Last modified on 1 February 2014, at 03:44

Talk:zero

Return to "zero" page.

Plural FormEdit

Why is zeroes (with an E) listed as the plural form while zeros (no E) is used in the examples?

  • Thanks for spotting that. Both forms are valid. Fixed. SemperBlotto 11:51, 13 March 2009 (UTC)

PronunciationEdit

Why has the pronunciation been "corrected"? I have never once heard anybody pronounce the word "zero" in this way with 3 syllables or two diphthongs. If you say it this way or have heard it this way then adding it with a comment on dialect would be fine. But replacing the only pronunciation I've ever heard with this rarity (if it exists at all) is certainly not a correction. Hippietrail 23:42, 19 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Well, I pronounce it that way. I admit, it's not the way one usually thinks the word is pronounced, but when I pay attention to what my tongue actually does when I say the word, I find that from the "e" it first moves down, then back to the "r", so there's a hidden diphthong. Perhaps this sort of detail is mainly of interest to phoneticists, but I don't think that makes it incorrect. Ortonmc 05:09, 20 Mar 2004 (UTC)
Mea culpa - this was my doing. Perhaps I ought to have written "modified" rather than "corrected" :) I stand by this change though - that is the standard (UK RP) IPA for "zero". The sound "ear" (non-rhotic) in "zero" and other words is transcribed as iota + schwa (sorry, browser I'm using at the moment doesn't show the IPA characters) - which means that I didn't "correct" it after all, as I merely added a schwa after i + length symbol. The pronunciation is still two syllables ("zear" + "roh"). So a further modification is required. Could someone do this for me, please?
That said, pronouncing the first syllable as "zi + length symbol" is standard in some parts of the world (South Africa? Australia?) and so perhaps this should also be acknowledged in the pronunciation. -- Paul G 08:30, 20 Mar 2004 (UTC)
I've had a quick look and updated the article but then I found more. AHD lists /"zi@r@U/ then /"zi:r@U/ so I'm not sure if this means American pronunciation can be either of if AHD lists British pronunciations as well. In Australia it's definitely the latter but I'm interested so I'll look in some more dictionaries when I find them... Hippietrail 12:24, 20 Mar 2004 (UTC)
In the States, I've heard either of the two, and also a short i in the first syllable (/"zir@U/?) or even just /"zir@/. I'm not sure how much detail to go into here (see talk:Well-Enunciated American English). Even an untrained listener will notice that some people seem to say "zeero" and some people seem to say "zirro".

un-redirect 0Edit

See Talk:0 for proposed definition. 1 and 0 have specific meanings (on/off;true/false) in computer science and (Boolean) logic. 0 and 1 are used repeatedly in definitions of logical functions which require these meanings. Rmo13 02:52, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

Re-order definitions (& clarification)Edit

The physical representation of zero as a numeral or digit should be the next definition, imho. The first definition of the number should have the word numeral removed. Non-negativity and Non-Positivity don't really define zero (in current last definition), and can lead to circular definitions.Rmo13 18:12, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

New Definition?Edit

noun: any representation or physical manifestation of zero

She signed zero in ASL.
The abacus was set to zero.
Are you suggesting to use "zero" in its own definition?!! 65.183.135.40 02:04, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Derived termsEdit

verb: Moved to articleRmo13 20:52, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

AdjectiveEdit

pertaining to zero n
  1. Of no quantity or amount; of zero cardinality. Usage: zero + plural.
    I have zero dollars.
  2. Of a representation or physical manifestation of zero.
    The zero sign in ASL is considered rude in some cultures.
  3. Relating to a point on a scale at which numbering or measurement begins.
    When expenses are the same as income, there is zero profit.
  4. No, or of no importance or value.
    She showed zero respect.
  5. (mathematics) Relating to a value of a function’s independent variables for which the function is equal to zero.
    The mean value theorem can imply a zero crossing.
  6. (mathematics) Relating to the identity element of an additive group.
    The zero matrix must be of correct dimension.

SynonymsEdit

1,4 no

Derived termsEdit

Translations of cardinal numberEdit

These need to be marked as adj or noun for languages where it matters. For example Polish is zero neuter noun, zerowy adj. Russian is similar.

Rmo13 11:51, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

I've added an adjective definition now. However I'm not convinced of the need to add adjective senses that are so closely related to a noun sense that it is unclear if they really are adjectives at all. Just because a word modifies a noun doesn't make it an adjective.
As for the derived terms. I'm not sure all of them are adjective derivations either. It is often hard to determine what derived from what word class. Hmm... --Patrik Stridvall 19:29, 6 April 2006 (UTC)
Thanks. The derived terms were split according to function. I agree that the adjective is very close and think that it should be subsidary to the noun (and should probably follow for that reason). zero-sum is probably noun derived since it represents sum = zero; zero hour and zero point derive from adjective usage. As a user of Slavic technical dictionaries, I have become a bit OCD about words modifying nouns be seen as adjectives. English is quite free about using nouns as adjectives, but in the case of zero there are a couple of lexical consequences.Rmo13 20:42, 6 April 2006 (UTC)
I think it looks good now. As for nouns as adjectives in English, it also complicates translations into Swedish a bit since we prefer to do noun-noun compounds rather than using one of the words as an adjective. To makes things worse, some words are both adjectives and nouns and the meaning is slightly different depending if you construct a adjective-noun phrase or a noun-noun compound. In a few cases the meaning is entirely different, so some spelling mistakes can be very funny. :-) --Patrik Stridvall 21:34, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

zeros vs. zeroesEdit

Is there any general consensus on which is more appropriate for a British-English or Canadian-English speaker? I tend to prefer the latter but I've had teachers nitpick it, and other teachers leave it well enough alone. --Jtgibson 18:30, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

http://www.bartleby.com/68/49/6649.html indicates both are valid, with no specification as where one or the other is preferred. --Connel MacKenzie 18:57, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

WelshEdit

Need Welsh translation at Category:cy:Cardinal_numbers. 24.29.228.33 02:50, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

RFVEdit

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The following discussion has been moved from Wiktionary:Requests for verification.

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Tagged but not listed. Kurdish Rfv-sense: a noun meaning "yellow". Uncontested is the second sense, "blond". - -sche (discuss) 22:33, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

RFV-failed. - -sche (discuss) 01:41, 20 September 2011 (UTC)