Talk:tenant

A tenant rents TO others?

Sense no. 3 (as of 2009-08-22) says that a "tenant(law) [is o]ne who rents their own property to others." This seems bizarre. Are their any citations to support this claim? Certainly today, in vernacular usage, a tenant is one who rents their property from others. N2e 16:09, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

In the legal sense (e.g. tenants in common) a tenant can indeed let their property to others, but this usage would not normally be found, even in law. Since 1607 (Cowell) at least, a tenant has been "one that holds or possesses Lands or Tenements by any kind of Right, be it in Fee, for Life, Years, or at Will". Dbfirs 12:35, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

I see your point Dbfirs, and agree with your conclusion. A person who is a tenant MAY (sometimes) legally sublet their rented property to others. But I don't think that is how the word is used. The person is a (noun) tenant because they are renting property FROM others. That the person who is a tenant because they rent FROM others can, sometimes, then go on to sublet the property to others, does not make the noun tenant be defined by the latter relationship, anymore than the word tenant would have a sense meaning "farmer'" should the tenant happen to farm the land they have rented. N2e 19:17, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Tenant- a person / legal entity renting immovable property FROM a landowner. User:196.207.47.60, 14:04, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

... (to 196.207) ... but the point I was making is that rent doesn't have to be involved at all. A tenant can be the legal owner. Dbfirs 07:47, 13 September 2009 (UTC)

... (to N2e) ... It doesn't have to be a case of sub-letting. A tenant in law can be legal owner with no rent involved. I've adjusted the legal definition accordingly, but I agree with your removal of the disputed sense. Dbfirs 07:56, 13 September 2009 (UTC)

Yes, that is correct. I like how you handled it by clarifying the (law)-related sense.N2e 14:38, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Request for verification

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Rfv-sense: Legal one who rents their own property to others. Huh? DCDuring TALK 16:53, 22 August 2009 (UTC)

In the legal sense (e.g. ownership as tenants in common) a tenant can indeed let their property to others, but this usage would not normally be found, even in law. Since 1607 (Cowell) at least, a tenant has been "one that holds or possesses Lands or Tenements by any kind of Right, be it in Fee, for Life, Years, or at Will". I suggest that we delete sense 3 and slightly extend sense 4. Dbfirs 12:38, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

I just want to give our legal types a chance to look at this too. I see it the same way. Though tenants may have the right to collect rent for the use of the property by others, it didn't seem to be a suitable definition. The tenant could also renounce his ownership interest, but one hardly be likely to define a tenant as a renouncer. DCDuring TALK 23:06, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

Tenant in the general sense of "one who owns land by some title" is in the OED (all editions give it as sense 1 of tenancy), and also in Black's. Thus it can (or could, back when this sense was in general circulation) certainly refer to an owner who is renting land... However, that "tenant" would be used to refer exclusively to landlords strains credulity. Should be rephrased, I think. -- Visviva 12:58, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Striking; users N2e and Dbfirs seem to have addressed this completely by doing as Dbfirs suggests above. (I'm not marking this "RFV failed", because the tagged sense did not have its full month in the entry; but I definitely don't think anyone should re-add it without at least some evidence.) —Ruakh_TALK 23:27, 6 March 2010 (UTC)