User:ND381/Wu Expansion

Basic concept

I’ve seen some plans for Suzhounese and Wenzhounese implementation into Wiktionary, and Shanghainese people complaining that Wiktionary’s Shanghainese not being the most accurate. This is a page for me to plan out implementing Wugniu Romanisation, possibly completely replacing Wiktionary’s Shanghainese Romanisation.

Hopefully the result should display as such (example word: 人 - 白讀):

* Wu
 * (Shanghai)
  * Wugniu: gnin6
  * Old Wiktionary: nyin (T3)
  * Sinological IPA: /ȵin¹¹³/
 * (Suzhou)
  * Wugniu: gnin2
  * Sinological IPA: /ȵin²²³/
 * (Hangzhou)
  * Wugniu: gnin2
  * Sinological IPA (new and old): /ȵin²¹³/
 * (Ningbo)
  * Wugniu: gnin2
  * Sinological IPA: /ȵin²⁴/
 * (Wenzhou)
  * Wugniu: gnian2
  * Sinological IPA: /ȵaŋ³¹/

And when collapsed:

* Wu
 (Shanghai, Wugniu) gnin6
 (Suzhou, Wugniu) gnin2
 (Hangzhou, Wugniu) gnin2
 (Ningbo, Wugniu) gnin2
 (Wenzhou, Wugniu) gnian2

Shanghainese (done!!)

What we have now is functional but not great. The following two tables show how we can get a Wugniu reflex when given a Wiktionary input, and a slight update to the IPA to be more accurate according to the 方言志, as well as what many Shanghainese people say is correct.

A module is present at Module:User:Manishearth/wuu-pron. See more at User:Manishearth/zh-pron-sandbox, Module:User:Manishearth/zh-pron, and Module_talk:wuu-pron#Prototype_with_wugniu_pronunciation.

Full implementation is soon to come; the module has been fully prepared

Romanisation

Initials

WT	Wugniu
m	m
’m	m
n	n
’n	n
l	l
’l	l
j	c
q	ch
jj	j
ny	gn
’ny	gn
x	sh
xx	zh
ng	ng
’ng	ng
hh	gh*

Finals

WT	Wugniu
y	iu
yoe	ioe
aan	aon
iaan	iaon
uaan	uaon
un	uen
yn	iun
yq	iuq
r	y
mm	m
ngg	ng

Tones

WT	Wugniu
1	1
2	5
3	6
4	7
5	8

The tone numbers skip 2-5 in order to facilitate other tone categories that are found in other Wu languages.
[*] Note that ɦ + i → y and ɦ + u → w, eg. ɦyn → yun, ɦuən → wen. This applies to all Wu languages unless specified.

IPA

As many have pointed out, the current IPA is a bit funky, to say the least. Sadly, since Wyang has left Wiktionary, we cannot ask where he obtained the IPA readings. Whatever his reasons may be, I believe the following is more accurate and preferred by Shanghainese learners and speakers.

Current	Updated	Reason
o̝	o	unnecessary, cleans up notation, captures speech of more speakers better
ʋʷ	u
ə̆ŋ	ən
ʊ̆ŋ	oŋ
ɪ̆ɲ	in
i̯ʊ̆ŋ	ioŋ
u̯ə̆ŋ	uən
ʏ̆ɲ	yn
All ɜ	Replace with ɤ	to be in line with dictionaries
əɻ	əl

All unnecessary diacritics, such as breves and devoicing diacritics, shall be removed.

Implementation

As per wiktionary:Beer parlour/2022/August#Shanghainese IPA update and Wugniu Romanisation, the following is to be done:

• The IPA notation is to be replaced (no disagreement)
• Wugniu will be displayed as the default in the collapsed table, and Wiktionary's transliteration will be kept in the expanded part as a legacy feature (general agreement)
• A temporary category “w-sh” shall be introduced for Wugniu. This would mean that other modules that rely on the old Wiktionary module will still be functional until they are made to be compatible with the new Wugniu one (general agreement, also see Discord server)
• Tone notation will be discussed in the Beer Parlour until a consensus is achieved

Suzhounese (done!!)

Here is the scheme for Wugniu’s Romanisation for Suzhounese.

Initials

IPA	Wugniu	Example words
m	m	忙
pʰ	ph	噴
p	p	包
b	b	排
f	f	方
v	v	房
n	n	南
tʰ	th	湯
t	t	東
d	d	唐
tsʰ	tsh	草
ts	ts	糟
s	s	山
z	z	邪
l	l	來
ȵ	gn	娘
tɕʰ	ch	欺
tɕ	c	京
dʑ	j	棋
ɕ	sh	虛
ŋ	ng	岸
kʰ	kh	開
k	k	高
g	g	共
ʔ	(not notated)	安
h	h	海
ɦ	gh	孩

Finals

IPA	Wugniu	Example words
ɑ	a	拉
iɑ	ia	借
uɑ	ua	怪
æ	au	包
iæ	iau	苗
e	e	班
ue	ue	關
i	ie	邊
o	o	巴
io	io	靴
ʏ	ieu	九
ø	oe	半
iø	ioe	捐
uø	uoe	官
øy	eu	州
ɪ	i	非
u	u	布
y	iu	渠
əu	ou	租
ã	an	浜
iã	ian	想
uã	uan	鐄
ɑ̃	aon	幫
iɑ̃	iaon	旺*
uɑ̃	uaon	狂
ən	en	本
in	in	賓
uən	uen	滾
yn	iun	軍
oŋ	on	風
ioŋ	ion	窮
aʔ	aeq	襪
iaʔ	iaeq	甲*
uaʔ	uaeq	刮
yaʔ	iuaeq	曰
ɑʔ	aq	百
iɑʔ	iaq	約
əʔ	eq	不
iəʔ	iq	筆
uəʔ	ueq	骨
yəʔ	iuq	粵
oʔ	oq	八
ioʔ	ioq	曲
m	m	嘸
n	n	唔
ŋ	ng	吳*
ɿ	y	資
ʮ	yu	知
əl	er	而

[*] Vernacular reading for all

Tones

IPA	Classical Quality	Wugniu
44	dark level	1
223	light level	2
51	rising	3
523	dark departing	5
231	light departing	6
43	dark checked	7
23	light checked	8

Unchecked Tone Sandhi

chain length → ↓ 1st char tone cat	2 char	3 char	4 char
dark level (1)	4 0	4 4 0	4 4 4 0
light level (2)	2 3	2 3 0	2 3 4 0
rising (3)	5 1	5 1 0	5 1 1 0
dark departing (5)	52 3	52 3 0	52 3 4 0
light departing (6)	23 1	23 1 0	23 1 1 0

Checked tone sandhi

chain length →		2 char	3 char	4 char
2nd char tone cat	1st char darkness
level (1, 2)	dark (7)	4 23	4 23 0	4 23 4 0
	light (8)	2 3	2 3 0	2 3 4 0
rising (3)	dark (7)	5 51	5 51 0	5 51 1 0
	light (8)	2 51	2 51 0	2 51 1 0
departing (5, 6)	dark (7)	5 523	5 52 3	5 52 2 3
	light (8)	2 523	2 52 3	2 52 2 3
checked (7, 8)	dark (7)	4 4	4 4 0	4 4 4 2
	light (8)	3 4	3 4 0	3 4 2 0

Note that this is one of many realisations of Suzhounese tone sandhi and this is the best compremise we have found so far. Each space (␣) represents a new syllable's tone contour, and does not take into account the vowel length of each syllable.

Right prominent sandhi

Only exists for dark departing: 523 > 51. 笑別人 is realised as shiau^{523 > 51} + biq²-gnin⁵¹ thus resulting in a tone merger : 考兒子 = 靠兒子.

However, this only occurs when the dark departing term is monosyllabic, so 考考兒子 ≠ 靠靠兒子.

Taken from 蘇州方言語音研究 (汪平 編著)

Wenzhounese

Here is the scheme for Wugniu’s Romanisation for Wenzhounese. Note that this scheme contradicts a lot of other publications and is still in the works.

Initials

IPA	Wugniu	Example words
m	m	蜜
pʰ	ph	撲
p	p	北
b	b	被
f	f	火
v	v	還
n, ʔn	n	拿
tʰ	th	通
t	t	東
d	d	同
s	s	耍
z	z	邪
tsʰ	tsh	差
ts	ts	抓
dz	dz	茶
l, ʔl	l	龍
ȵ, ʔȵ	gn	你
ɕ	sh	先
tɕʰ	ch	超
tɕ	c	正
dʑ	j	鯨
j	y*	前
ŋ, ʔŋ	ng	昂
kʰ	kh	看
k	k	高
g	g	摜
ʔ	(not notated)	壓
h	h	好
ɦ	gh	紅

Finals

IPA	Wugniu	Example words
a	a	山
ɛ	ae	杏
e	e	改
ə	eo	好
ø	oe	暗
o	o	花
i	i	折
u	u	歌
y	iu	絕
ai	ai	枚
ei	ei	的
au	au	搜
ɤu	ou	楚
øy	eu	土
aŋ	an	尋
eŋ	en	命
oŋ	on	風
ia	ia	藥
iɛ	iae	笑
iai	iai	一
iau	iau	扭
ieu	iou	育
iaŋ	ian	經
ioŋ	ion	營
uɔ	uao	慌
yɔ	iuao	共
yo	io	續
n	n	嗯
ŋ	ng	二
ɿ	y	知

Tones

Tones

IPA	Classical Quality	Wugniu
⁴⁴	yin-level	1
³¹	yang-level	2
³⁵	yin-rising	3
³⁵	yang-rising	4
⁵²	yin-departing	5
²²	yang-departing	6
³²³	yin-checked	7
³²³	yang-checked	8

[*]: Note that because Wenzhounese has a phonemic /j/ distinction, y is used with the /j/ initial instead. Eg. jau → yau

Furthern expansions

I might do Hangzhounese, Ningbonese, and Taizhounese romanisations eventually. Yeah that's it

Hangzhounese

We are aware of the alternative classifications of Hangzhounese that put it in the Mandarin category. However due to the lect also using the Wugniu scheme, it shall be covered as a Wu variety until further notice.

Wugniu does not notate New Period Hangzhounese innovations, such as the merger between [ᴇ̃] and [ᴇ]. A future module should hopefully be able to notate both in its IPA.

Initials

IPA	Wugniu	Example words
p	p	布
pʰ	ph	怕
b	b	步
m	m	門
f	f	飛
v	v	父
t	t	到
tʰ	th	太
d	d	道
n	n	難
ts	ts	張
tsʰ	tsh	醋
dz	dz	床
s	s	色
z	z	乳
tɕ	c	精
tɕʰ	ch	秋
dʑ	j	晴
ȵ	gn	年
ɕ	sh	性
k	k	官
kʰ	kh	寬
g	g	狂
ŋ	ng	呆
h	h	歡
ɦ	gh	河
ʔ	(not notated)	亞

Finals

IPA	Wugniu	Example words
ɿ	y	資
i	i	比
u	u	五
ʮ	yu	珠
y	iu	舉
ə	(only found in this word, listed as əʔ)	得
m	m	姆
n	unclear, possibly n ~ ng	（～娘）
əl	er	兒
ɑ	a	爸
iɑ	ia	家
uɑ	ua	瓜
ʮɑ	ua (old period ya)	抓
ɛ	e	拜
iɛ	ie	街
uɛ	ue	快
ʮɛ	ue (old period ye)	揣
ɔ	au	冒
iɔ	iau	吊
o	o	拖
uo	uo	話
ø	merged into ei (old period eu)	勾
iø	ieu	酒
ei	ei	梅
ui	uei	推
ʮei	uei (old period yei)	車
ɛ̃	aen (new period e)	犯
iɛ̃	ien (new period ie)	天
uõ	uon (new period uo)	暖
ʮõ	uon (old period yon) (new period uo)	穿
yõ	iuon (new period iuo)	拳
en	en	輪
in	in	金
un	uen	文
ʮen	uen (old period yen)	孫
yn	iun	運
ɑŋ	an	糖
iɑŋ	ian	兩
uɑŋ	uan	橫
ʮɑŋ	uan (old period yan)	狀
oŋ	on	朋
ioŋ	ion	用
ɑʔ	aq	八
iɑʔ	iaq	腳
uɑʔ	uaq	滑
ʮɑʔ	uaq (old period yaq)	刷
əʔ	eq	不
iəʔ	iq	壁
ʮəʔ	ueq (old period yeq)	熱
yəʔ	iuq	菊
oʔ	oq	北
ioʔ	ioq	玉
uoʔ	uoq	活

Underlined text indicate possible in-house fill-ins for missing rimes. They are left out of Wugniu's romanisation due to an early New Period shift removing this rime

Tones

IPA	Category	Wugniu
33	dark level	1
213	light level	2
53	rising	3
445	dark departing	5
13	light departing	6
5	dark checked	7
2	light checked	8

2-character tone sandhi

↓ syl 2 / syl 1 →	33	53	445	213	13	5	2
33	33 33					33 5
53	53 53					53 5
445	44 21					35 5
213	11 33	11 53	11 35	11 33		11 5
13	13 53					13 5
5	5 33	5 53	5 35	5 33		4 5
2	2 33	2 53	2 35	2 33		2 5	2 2

3 or more character sandhi could not be found. Taken from 浙江省語言志 and 杭州方言詞典