Template talk:es-conj-ar

Third person pronouns

The third person pronouns in Spanish conjugations are "él" (singular) and "ellos" (plural). "Usted" and "ustedes" are polite pronouns for the second person, only that are used with the third person pronoun. — This unsigned comment was added by Ambil (talk • contribs).

You're very right. See Template:es-conj-ar/experiment for a work in progress solution. --Bequw → ¢ • τ 04:09, 22 October 2008 (UTC)

I strongly prefer it with usted. The conjugation tables are about verbs, not pronouns. The usted is merely a placeholder for the 3rd person. There is no reason to include every conceivable pronoun in the column heads, because it isn’t about pronouns. By using usted, it not only works as a good header for the 3rd person, but it also shows that usted governs the 3rd person, not the 2nd. Template:es-conj-ar/experiment looks very clunky and I think it’s a bad idea. —Stephen 16:34, 22 October 2008 (UTC)

Template:es-conj-ar/experiment is a bit clunky, but it's unambiguously correct which I think overrides aesthetics (and sadly we aren't unfamiliar with clunky layouts here:). Users that don't understand how verbs conjugate with pronouns/persons could be confused, and users that do understand will get annoyed (like Ambil and I). If we want sleaker presentation, rather than two rows of pronouns and persons, one could suffice. Since it's more language-generic to speak in terms of persons I'd be fine with removing the pronoun rows altogether and inlining a note about usted(es) (either by putting a footnote next to "third" or by rewording it like "third (+ Ud.)". I'll be trying to use a standard layout template for all our verb conjugation varieties (probably at {{es-conj}}), so if it needs tweaking will be able to control it easily. --Bequw → ¢ • τ 02:00, 23 October 2008 (UTC)

I see that it is a matter of aesthetics versus clearness, but respectfully I disagree on that the table is only about verbs and not pronouns. It's confusing to indicate the person even with a "mere placeholder" other than the original for the forms. Usted(es) are used with 3rd person forms, but the sense isn't absolutely that of the third persons. I mean, that is a reason to include a true representative pronoun. I've just seen the experiment, after I discussed the -er and -ir tables, now I think this experimental table is a much better solution. But I still don't understand why are these sort of templates protected, they should be semi-protected. Excuse my ignorance, anyway. ºRYueli'o 00:26, 8 December 2008 (UTC) talk

They are protected because they are so high-use and editing makes the job queue go up a lot. Not that that affects us much, it's just what is done for all high use templates. Nadando 00:31, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

Adding a few lines

Hi there, please can an admin add the following lines to the template

|vos1={{#if: {{{ref_stem|}}}|se|}} [[{{{1}}}ás]]
|vos2={{#if: {{{ref_stem|}}}|se|}} [[{{{1}}}és]]
|vos3={{#if: {{{ref_stem|}}}|se|}} [[{{{1}}}á]]

They are the 'vos' forms. -WF

vos

Hello,

I think we should either change "(Central American spelling)" in the present subjunctive row to "(Central America)" or put it below the vos form; as it is currently, it looks rather clunky and inelegant.

Espreon (talk) 15:18, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

I agree; I welcome the inclusion of "vos" forms, but it is not entirely correct to say "Central America", since this use is also common in other regions of "voseo" such as Colombia (I'm form there) and Mexico, which are not part of Central America. The note is relevant to clarify that Argentine and Uruguayan "voseo" use the "tú" forms for the subjunctive, but perhaps it would be better just to add a footnote saying "not used in Argentine and Uruguayan voseo", or something to that effect. --Edgefield (talk) 21:04, 25 January 2014 (UTC)