Reconstruction talk:Proto-West Germanic/falljō

RFD discussion: March 2020–July 2024

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This discussion is no longer live and is left here as an archive. Please do not modify this conversation, but feel free to discuss its conclusions.

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Reconstruction:Proto-West Germanic/fellō

Same as *dubbjan above. —Rua (mew) 12:37, 10 March 2020 (UTC)

Keep: OHG added. --{{victar|talk}} 19:52, 10 March 2020 (UTC)

You're aware that this is RFV, right? There's no keep/delete votes. —Rua (mew) 20:16, 10 March 2020 (UTC)

Keep: --{{victar|talk}} 20:25, 10 March 2020 (UTC)

...kay. —Rua (mew) 10:38, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

@Rua: So does that resolve this? --{{victar|talk}} 20:08, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

I'm not entirely sure if having only an OHG descendant is enough either. But I'll leave that to third parties to decide. @Mnemosientje, Mahagaja, DerRudymeister —Rua (mew) 20:18, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

If there really aren't any other West Germanic reflexes, then I'd be inclined to delete and just say the Latin is a loanword from OHG. It's not clear where OHG fello comes from, though, since Proto-Germanic *faluz doesn't have an OHG reflex. —Mahāgaja · talk 21:14, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

Based on the context of the Latin attestations, it looks to have originated from Frankish, not OHG, and if we were to say it didn't exist in PWG, we have to somehow explain how it was novelly constructed in OHG. --{{victar|talk}} 08:00, 1 April 2020 (UTC)

Could it possibly be from Proto-Germanic *fal(l)jô, a derivative of *faluz, or perhaps a derivative of Old Dutch fellen (“to destroy, ruin”)/Old High German fellen (“to throw down, defeat, demean, devalue”) ? Leasnam (talk) 02:20, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

@Mahagaja @Victar I apologise for reviving a 4-year old discussion, but from what I can see, the Old High German term only exists in so far as Medieval Latin fello *might* come from OHG, thus constituting what Köbler calls a "lateinisch-althochdeutsch" mix. In the Althochdeutsches Wörterbuch, there is no 'fello'.

One option is to rework the page to *fillō or *fillijō, which several sources construct as ancestor for the Latin term (but that might also come from fel (“bile”)).

(and then there's the whole issue with *faluz, which might simply be a ghost reconstruction, but I'd like to know if recent sources have something to say about those Old English compounds) Exarchus (talk) 15:53, 17 July 2024 (UTC)

I think it makes most sense to move the entry to *falljō, from Proto-Germanic *faljô, a derivative of *faluz. Leasnam (talk) 22:27, 28 January 2023 (UTC)

PWG *-jō was plenty productive, so *falu +‎ *-jō is also possible. --Sokkjō (talk) 09:44, 29 January 2023 (UTC)

I've moved the entry to RC:Proto-West Germanic/falljō. @Mahagaja, Leasnam if you believe this addresses the RFD, please resolve. -- Sokkjō 19:44, 16 October 2023 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘ The redirect from *fellō to *falljō has been deleted as per @Sokkjo's deletion request. Kutchkutch (talk) 19:56, 26 December 2023 (UTC)

RFD-kept. This has long been resolved. Moved to *falljō. —Caoimhin ceallach (talk) 18:00, 1 June 2024 (UTC)