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Talk:Nazi

Tea room discussionEdit

Note: the below discussion was moved from the Wiktionary:Tea room.

When I called myself a "sum-of-parts Nazi" in the section above, I looked up Nazi to see whether Wiktionary had the slang sense of a disciplinarian, and I suddenly remembered my history teacher at secondary school. She insisted on calling them the "nazzies" (a bit like the navvies, who also came up in modern history), which tended to amuse the class because we all knew they were "nart-sees". So I suddenly wonder whether this is a legitimate Anglicisation or merely one teacher's bizarre kink. Anybody know? Equinox 22:31, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

I've heard that too, but I suppose it must be an affected use, because my standard references don't have it. I'll add pronunciation, though. Michael Z. 2009-01-22 22:56 z
Sounds like a spelling pronunciation. (Taivo 02:36, 23 January 2009 (UTC))
I seem to recall Winston Churchill was known for deliberately and consistently mispronouncing "Nazi" as "nah-zee" (i.e., without the "t" sound). Pingku 06:38, 23 January 2009 (UTC)
John S. Kenyon and Thomas A. Knott argue in A Pronouncing Dictionary of American English that it is in the best principles to English to so pronounce foreign words instead of using a bastardized version of the foreign pronunciation. I uploaded File:Henry Hall - Japs and Nazis.ogg as an example of this pronunciation; unfortunately, due to the nature of flowing speech, I couldn't extract just the word Nazi and have it sound natural.--Prosfilaes (talk) 10:45, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

RFCEdit

The following discussion has been moved from Wiktionary:Requests for cleanup.

This discussion is no longer live and is left here as an archive. Please do not modify this conversation, but feel free to discuss its conclusions.


I think the sense "consisting of Nazis" (as opposed to "pertaining to Nazism") is an effort to distinguish "Nazi" as in "a Nazi group" from "Nazi" as in "his Nazi ideals"... but if that distinction is worthwhile, and I'm not sure it is, there must be a better way of wording the sense. - -sche (discuss) 05:50, 8 November 2012 (UTC)

For me, it's a delete. Mglovesfun (talk) 22:18, 8 November 2012 (UTC)
As a noun, English has Nazi and Nazism (National Socialist and National Socialism). It is quite possible that other languages have that distinction in adjectives, and then the distinction would be worthwhile. --129.125.102.126 22:22, 8 November 2012 (UTC)
That's a fair point. Mglovesfun (talk) 12:01, 9 November 2012 (UTC)
I've combined the senses. - -sche (discuss) 08:38, 22 November 2012 (UTC)


Etymological infoEdit

From diff: "In the 24th edition of Etymologisches Wörterbuch der deutschen Sprache - 2002, it states that the word Nazi was favoured in southern Germany (supposedly from c.1924) among opponents of National Socialism because the nickname Nazi, Naczi (from the masculine proper name Ignatz, the German form of Ignatius) was used colloquially to mean "a foolish person, clumsy or awkward person." - a Bavarian oaf. The popular Austrian Catholic name Ignatz was, according to a source in World War one a generic name German Empire term for Austrian-Hungarian soldiers."

As de:Nazi points out, Nazi was formed in analogy to Sozi (i. e., Sozialist or Sozialdemokrat) as well. This is supported by the additional formation Kozi for Kommunist (which I had never encountered before until now).
There's also de:Bazi, a derogative term for Bavarians, which may have played a role, if it was already current at the time – it is very usual now. --Florian Blaschke (talk) 15:06, 23 September 2014 (UTC)

Pejorativeness as a political designationEdit

As revert to my edit correctly points out, "Nazi" as a pejorative for "neo-Nazi" doesn't make a great deal of sense; however, "Nazi" as a pejorative for some of the other ideologies which are lumped together most certainly does. Also, put "identitarian" for "ethnic," ("ethnic ideology" is awkward, "identitarianism" is an ideology, "ethnicity" isn't, neither is "xenophobia", which is merely an attitude, not an ideology) and "White supremacist" and/or "White nationalist" for "racist," as this is by and large, the only sort of racism which the term is used for (even someone like wikipedia:Louis Farrakhan, a very serious anti-Semite, and arguably one with fascistic characteristics and even aesthetics, is not at all likely to get the label although I'm sured it's been used against him from time to time.)

Also thanks to same user for improving my addition as regards to etymology. (However, I think it is rather more than "possible" that this is the etymology; if I recall correctly, a specific journalist, Jewish and associated with the KPD if memory serves, is identifiably the source of this usage. Not recalling his name I would have to do further research.) PavelCristovic (talk) 20:32, 1 March 2018 (UTC)

I don't think that e.g. a newspaper calling e.g. a white supremacist fascist who would prefer not to be called a Nazi is pejorative (belittling), though; I think it's just claiming that the person is within the scope of the term as it is generally used to denote people who occupy a certain part of the ideological spectrum. Such claims can also be made in greyer cases, about people who are less obviously in that part of the ideological spectrum, but I'm not sure how that should be handled; in less extreme cases, it doesn't seem like a separate sense. At the extreme, of course, it bleeds into the tendency to use several political terms, not just this one, without any real meaning at all (think of all the people who described Barack Obama as a Nazi, communist, fascist, socialist, capitalist and Marxist, sometimes in the same sentence).
Regarding the etymology, many of the books cited as references for the etymology hedge the claim of influence to varying degrees, noting that Nazi as a shortening of national-sozial predates the NSDAP and has a straightforward phonological basis, and the "peasant" slang homonym only "possibly" or probably influenced the term's popularity. - -sche (discuss) 22:07, 1 March 2018 (UTC)
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