User talk:Mglovesfun


new messages at the bottom please!

Translation fix errorEdit

diff It looks like it made some mistakes, even causing script errors. —CodeCat 20:41, 26 July 2013 (UTC)

These pronoun entries contain a lot of nonstandard code. The translation tables are so massive that things like 'examples' and 'notes' in my opinion should only go in the entries themselves, not the translation tables. Anyway, it's a case of GIGO, the bad output is due to the garbage fed into it (make it think 'Notes' is a dialect). And yes I should really delete that crap before saving. Mglovesfun (talk) 20:44, 26 July 2013 (UTC)
no is another page with lots of non-standard formatting, if you're up for it (many of the translations don't have entries in the target language). DTLHS (talk) 20:46, 26 July 2013 (UTC)
There are problems on you as well. —CodeCat 20:48, 26 July 2013 (UTC)
I'm not really in now till the evening. I'm teaching some kids to juggle for a local community event, I'm just stopping for an hour to have lunch. Mglovesfun (talk) 13:12, 27 July 2013 (UTC)
Could you have a look at you and her soon? They're still showing a lot of script errors. —CodeCat 01:56, 2 August 2013 (UTC)
Me and who? Kidding, yes I can look at them. Am home unexpectedly early. Mglovesfun (talk) 13:25, 2 August 2013 (UTC)


Could you add an entry for this term, please? Thanks, Razorflame 22:22, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

Probably; sounds real, not heard of it, mind you. Mglovesfun (talk) 09:56, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

Wiktionary:Requests for deletion/Others#Slovak templatesEdit

Just noting your "note to self"... Cheers! bd2412 T 00:06, 2 August 2013 (UTC)

Thank you, those are the three with the most transclusions. They can nevertheless be archived. Mglovesfun (talk) 13:27, 2 August 2013 (UTC)
Will do. If there's anything I can do with respect to fixing the transclusions, I'll be glad to help. bd2412 T 13:29, 2 August 2013 (UTC)
I seem to think these entries have enough problems that they can't be fixed with AWB, it needs to be by hand. No rush really; more important to do it right than to do it quickly. Mglovesfun (talk) 20:22, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

The translation gadgetEdit

Are you using your own custom version of this? The edits I made to it a few days ago aren't appearing in your edit to shear today, it is still adding {{t-SOP}} to entries. —CodeCat 21:34, 2 August 2013 (UTC)

No, perhaps if I clear my caché that will do it. Mglovesfun (talk) 21:37, 2 August 2013 (UTC)
Ok, thank you. Can you let me know the next time you fix an entry with it and it gives a message about a SOP term? I'd like to know what it does. —CodeCat 22:05, 2 August 2013 (UTC)

Niðurlond and Template:gEdit

The "old" {{g}} was moved to {{rfgender}} a little while ago, and its place was taken by a general template for displaying genders that would replace {{m}}, {{f}} etc. But in this case you don't even need {{rfgender}}, you can also specify ? as the gender instead which will tell {{head}} to add a request category to the page. —CodeCat 19:54, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

So in summary, g=? instead of g=g, right? Mglovesfun (talk) 20:19, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
Yes. You can also partially specify the gender or mark it to be checked, by using "f-?" or similar. That will mark it as "tentatively feminine" and add the entry to the request category too. —CodeCat 20:22, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
That's new then; there are a few Old French words where as far as I can tell, the gender isn't attested, but dictionaries like the Godefroy give a gender, probably based on the etymon, the Modern French descendant, or both. Mglovesfun (talk) 20:24, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
Yes, all of these are new features that were added when the templates were converted to use Lua. There have been a lot of other new features for templates like {{term}}, {{l}} and {{t}} too. —CodeCat 20:30, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

BP: Phonosemantic interpretationEdit

Hi Martin,

You initiated a discussion back in June at BP: Phonosemantic interpretation (thanks!). The discussion continued at great length and you signed off, requesting a summary if it ever terminated.

It’s terminated (after 74 kB).

I reverted these contributions, as they were obviously unsuitable (obviously wrong, speculative, unreferenced, redundant, and didn’t fit form). Further, the cited reference itself (Lawrence’s e-book) is obviously wrong (it gives superficial and incorrect analyses of present Japanese character forms, and makes no mention of Old Chinese or the original character forms) and not suitable as a reference. There are some more details at BP: Revert if you’re interested.

While the edits themselves were not helpful, they have sparked a useful discussion at BP: Old Chinese etymologies, so some good is coming of this. Thanks again for sparking the discussion!

—Nils von Barth (nbarth) (talk) 14:42, 10 August 2013 (UTC)


Your definition is ambiguous; it says tight as a noun, but there is no noun tight. Do you mean tights? Mglovesfun (talk) 01:50, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Yes, I mean tights. We say not plural in Turkish as shoes, eyes. But, thank you that you said me true. --123snake45 (talk) 21:13, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

lorem ipsumEdit

Do you take Wiktionary seriously?

Not suspicious or anything, just curious. --Æ&Œ (talk) 20:40, 26 August 2013 (UTC)

Depends what you mean really. I never expect it to become a good dictionary. Not before the end of my lifetime anyway. Does that answer your question? Mglovesfun (talk) 20:41, 26 August 2013 (UTC)
I believe so, yes. I used to take this project super seriously, but now I look at it as a means of filling in time more than anything else. --Æ&Œ (talk) 20:46, 26 August 2013 (UTC)


Notice anything delete‐worthy in there? —Æ&Œ (talk) 23:38, 15 September 2013 (UTC)


I've been catching up on reading your blog again, Gloves. Just so you know that some people out there read it. Good luck in the job hunt.

Vandal spilling from other wikisEdit

There's a vandal that keeps making new accounts just to vandalise. I've blocked a few of them so far, could you keep an eye out as well? —CodeCat 13:20, 30 August 2013 (UTC)

Up to a point; isn't that what WT:VIP is for? To alert as many active admins as possible? Mglovesfun (talk) 13:32, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
Oh I had forgotten about that. —CodeCat 13:34, 30 August 2013 (UTC)

Wikisaurus def subpagesEdit

Can you delete Wikisaurus:tiny/def, Wikisaurus:ephemeral/def, Wikisaurus:speedy/def, Wikisaurus:quickly/def, Wikisaurus:scrawny/def, Wikisaurus:obese/def, Wikisaurus:impoverished/def, Wikisaurus:gigantic/def, Wikisaurus:wealthy/def, Wikisaurus:enrage/def, Wikisaurus:fatigued/def per Template_talk:ws_refer#RFD? If you think the deletion of the pages does not follow from the linked RFD, please let me know and I'll nominate them again. Thanks. --Dan Polansky (talk) 08:46, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

Yes, seems straightforward enough. Mglovesfun (talk) 09:56, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

un coup, un peuEdit


I've just created this, but I see it doesn't exist on the French wiktionary. Do you think it's a valid entry? --Fsojic (talk) 22:10, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

Never heard of it. Could be an adverb. Mglovesfun (talk) 09:18, 1 September 2013 (UTC)


Can you create this? This word is more common than you may think. Yes, I’m being serious. --Æ&Œ (talk) 05:53, 2 September 2013 (UTC)

Category:English derived termsEdit

Why not delete it? All the categories are empty, and I'm pretty sure no consensus was ever found to have such categories. Do you remember the discussion about the now-deleted {{derv}} template? —CodeCat 20:45, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

The main problem is that you tagged it with {{delete}} with no edit summary, and no admin (including you) has seen fit to delete it. Mglovesfun (talk) 20:46, 3 September 2013 (UTC)
I thought it was self-evident why... because the categories are all empty. I hoped that by tagging it, someone might eventually have the time to do it. —CodeCat 20:47, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

Replacing bold headword with Template:headEdit

diff --Z 20:23, 8 September 2013 (UTC)

Still buggy[1] (let me know if you need help) --Z 15:52, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

Possibly use a character range that excludes '=' but I don't know what that is. I know it's buggy, just there's few enough to fix by hand and they all appear in Category:Pages with script errors, which is why I haven't even tried to fix it. Mglovesfun (talk) 16:20, 11 September 2013 (UTC)
I think we should fix the code because there's too many of them, what is the regex that you are using to find the language name? --Z 16:44, 11 September 2013 (UTC)
If you are using Python, you can try to use MWParserFromHell. It can split the page up into pieces so you don't need to do regexes. Instead, you ask it to give you all level 2 sections, and then you go over them one by one, making changes as necessary. You can do the same to identify POS headings within each language section as well, which in turn lets you find the headword line. This is helpful because searching for the pagename in bold doesn't always work. Sometimes the word in bold is not the page name but something else, like the page name with diacritics added or with links. —CodeCat 17:43, 11 September 2013 (UTC)
I put the regex on User talk:MglovesfunBot. ZxxZxxZ you commented, then removed your comment, I added it back because it was relevant and then replied. Mglovesfun (talk) 20:33, 11 September 2013 (UTC)

Undoing Rukhabot translation-template updates.Edit

I see you've undone Rukhabot's translation-template updates to certain pages. The problem is, if I don't change anything, they'll just get re-updated the next time I run it. Can you give me a rule for which pages you want me to skip? (Preferably a rule based on either the namespace, the page-name, or something easily recognizable in the page's wikitext.) —RuakhTALK 05:35, 9 September 2013 (UTC)

Update: After looking through all its non-mainspace edits from this run, I'm thinking that it should probably just run in mainspace entries and in appendices. Does that sound good? —RuakhTALK 06:19, 9 September 2013 (UTC)
Yes that. Someone else posted it on your talk page before I could. Mglovesfun (talk) 08:31, 9 September 2013 (UTC)



I'm not sure about the translation of this entry. I don't know the verb behove, but given its current definition ("fit, suit"), does it really... behove? Because it doesn't seem to convey the idea of obligation.

And so it falls to me to make this decision.
C'est donc à moi qu'il incombe de prendre cette décision.

But I don't know, because French wiktionary translates behove precisely with incomber. What do you think? --Fsojic (talk) 21:46, 12 September 2013 (UTC)

I looked up behove in my Oxford English Dictionary and it seems to fit incomber perfectly, just our definition for it is completely different. I wonder what other dictionaries are saying about behove. Mglovesfun (talk) 03:50, 13 September 2013 (UTC)


Hi there. If you fancy cleaning up any more of Shoofs stuff (like vacuum bag), most of them are in "Special:Uncategorized pages". Goo luck! SemperBlotto (talk) 10:46, 13 September 2013 (UTC)

That's exactly where I am. Mglovesfun (talk) 10:48, 13 September 2013 (UTC)

Song translationEdit

I've translated another song into Old French. Here are the lyrics:
Please, please forgive me,
But I won't be home again.
Maybe someday you'll look up,
And, barely conscious, you'll say to no one:
"Isn't something missing?"
You won't cry for my absence, I know -
You forgot me long ago.
Am I that unimportant...?
Am I so insignificant...?
Isn't something missing?
Isn't someone missing me?
Even though I'm the sacrifice,
You won't try for me, not now.
Though I'd die to know you love me,
I'm all alone.
Isn't someone missing me?
Please, please forgive me,
But I won't be home again.
I know what you do to yourself,
I breathe deep and cry out:
"Isn't something missing?
Isn't someone missing me?"
And if I bleed, I'll bleed,
Knowing you don't care.
And if I sleep just to dream of you
And wake without you there,
Isn't something missing?
Isn't something...
Even though I'm the sacrifice,
You won't try for me, not now.
Though I'd die to know you love me,
I'm all alone...
Isn't something missing?
Isn't someone missing me?...
S’il te plait, s’il te plait, me pardone
Mais jo ne retornera plus ad la maison
Se devient, garderas por moi
Et, ne conoistrant, tu ne diras:
Ne nïent est faillant?
Tu ne crïeras por mon absence, jo le sai
Tu me as ja a dis oublié
Ne nïent est faillant?
Ne un faille de me?
Bien soit que jo sui le sacrifice
Tu ne crïeras por me, ne or
Bien soit que jo morroie por savoir que tu me ames
Jo sui sol
Ne un faille de me?
S’il te plait, s’il te plait, me pardone
Mais jo ne retornera plus ad la maison
Jo sai que tu fez avuec te meïsme
Jo respire et jo escrïe:
Ne nïent est faillant?
Ne un faille de me?
Bien soit que jo sui le sacrifice
Tu ne crïeras por me, ne or
Bien soit que jo morroie por savoir que tu me ames
Jo sui sol
Ne un faille de me?
Si jo sainne
Jo saignera
Sachant que cel ne te chalt
Et si jo songiera que jo te voi
Et jo m’esveillera sans toi
Ne nïent est faillant?
Ne un faille de me?
Bien soit que jo sui le sacrifice
Tu ne crïeras por me, ne or
Bien soit que jo morroie por savoir que tu me ames
Mais jo sui sol
Ne nïent est faillant?
Ne un faille de me?
Are there any mistakes I would have to correct?
And one question, can I replace "cel" at "Sachant que..." with "chel" to create an aliteration with "chalt" to make that part more dramatic?
Thank you for your help.
Greetings HeliosX (talk) 17:24, 18 September 2013 (UTC)
Like last time, I don't mind picking out a few key words but it's way beyond my ability to translate a whole song. Mglovesfun (talk) 20:59, 18 September 2013 (UTC)
To cry is plorer, where crier is to cry as in to shout. Mglovesfun (talk) 21:27, 18 September 2013 (UTC)
Ok, I corrected that and in the refrain I also replaced "crïeras" with "essaieras". However, do I have to use the subjunctive after "que", for example in: "Bien soit que..."?
Greetings HeliosX (talk) 12:43, 19 September 2013 (UTC)
I have no idea, I only attempt to be able to understand Old French, not to be able to write it. Mglovesfun (talk) 14:01, 19 September 2013 (UTC)


Hey man, wishing you a happy birthday. You know that when you hit thirty, the chip in your mind flips. Glad I met you all those years ago, buddy. -WF

moving cretan ... to Cretan ...Edit

I don't necessarily disagree with you. BUT if you'd looked you would have noticed that I was busy editing here. A brief chat would have been a lot nicer and save me wondering what was going on! :) — Saltmarshαπάντηση 16:24, 20 September 2013 (UTC)

Quite simply, what's to disagree with? The word is Cretan not cretan. Mglovesfun (talk) 16:33, 20 September 2013 (UTC)
You don't get it do you!!! I didn't disagree with you and said so, and I know what the word is! As I said above A brief chat would have been nicer' since I was mid-editing. — Saltmarshαπάντηση 16:53, 20 September 2013 (UTC)
You said "I don't necessarily disagree with you." not "I agree with you". Mglovesfun (talk) 16:54, 20 September 2013 (UTC)
Agree/Disagree isn't the point (I tried to say this) - I was still editing the documentation when you moved the template - not very polite. I'll sign off before I'm rude. — Saltmarshαπάντηση 17:09, 20 September 2013 (UTC)
I didn't know that, I can't predict what edits you will make before you make them. Mglovesfun (talk) 17:15, 20 September 2013 (UTC)


Have you seen its talk page? SemperBlotto (talk) 10:29, 23 September 2013 (UTC)

Not heard of it but there's a facebook group 'jonglage', someone might have heard of it. Mglovesfun (talk) 10:38, 23 September 2013 (UTC)
Though the Wikipedia page lists bolas. Mglovesfun (talk) 10:40, 23 September 2013 (UTC)

Category:Variations of three-letter combinationsEdit

Thanks for creating this, and doing that recategorization job. Cheers! bd2412 T 13:49, 27 September 2013 (UTC)

in vitro diagnosticEdit

So. Why was it "totally wrong"?

(Apart from the empty references section. The system wouldn't let me add them - I was trying to find an admin so I could when you deleted it.)

Drianmcdonald (talk) 23:07, 1 October 2013 (UTC)

In vitro diagnostic is not a 'test', it is a diagnostic that occurs in vitro. It's a misunderstanding of w:In vitro diagnostics, which itself isn't very well written. Mglovesfun (talk) 08:37, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
Ahh. That makes sense. Wasn't clear you meant factually wrong. I copied over the definition as part of an attempt to merge w:In vitro diagnostics away, as the page is basically just a definition. I will probably try to create a better definition as part of the merge. It would be useful if I could add external links as part of the citation; as mentioned, I get an error message saying an admin needs to help me with that. Could you change my permissions? Have a look at w:User talk:drianmcdonald to confirm that I'm not a complete newbie.
But how would this mean WT:CFI#Idiomaticity? Isn't it just a diagnostic that's in vitro? In vitro has an adjective section. Mglovesfun (talk) 12:14, 2 October 2013 (UTC)
Point taken. There are other things you can say about in vitro diagnostics that you couldn't imply from the words - industrialisation and regulation, for example - but they are not contained in the definition Drianmcdonald (talk) 18:34, 10 October 2013 (UTC)


Delete User:OrenBochman/votes too, plz

more to deletedEdit

these bad boys have been archived

User:Wiktionary User_talk:Wiktionary. What the Hell? --Æ&Œ (talk) 13:41, 15 October 2013 (UTC)


Hi there. Italian Wiktionary has this word defined as "circus act consisting of juggling objects with your feet while you remain lying on your back and keep your legs raised more or less vertically". Any ideas for the English term? SemperBlotto (talk) 17:08, 6 October 2013 (UTC)

Usually just called 'foot juggling', though that covers juggling with your feet the right way up too. Type 'foot juggling' into YouTube and the first results are for what you describe. Mglovesfun (talk) 18:49, 6 October 2013 (UTC)


What's the use-case for that one? <honestly baffled> - Amgine/ t·e 18:17, 9 October 2013 (UTC)

What's a use-case? Mglovesfun (talk) 18:21, 9 October 2013 (UTC)
A circumstance in which something would be used. But I checked on bgc and found many so it's apparently just my English provincialism which says masculine terms shouldn't be maternal. - Amgine/ t·e 20:06, 9 October 2013 (UTC)
Instinct maternel? Mglovesfun (talk) 21:25, 9 October 2013 (UTC)

finishing offEdit

Hi Gloves. Any chance you could "[2] finish off the last three" so the RFD page can be trimmed even more. I'd finish them off for you, but I've no idea what you mean. -WF

Orphan them as using {{sk-noun|decl=foo}}, I added a decl parameter to sk-noun so that these would no longer be needed. You can archive it while the links are still blue. Mglovesfun (talk) 11:05, 11 October 2013 (UTC)
I don't understand. Show me with Peržan please. -WF
I have orphaned the templates {{sk-decl-chlap}}, {{sk-dub}}, and {{žena}}, so they can be deleted. --Dan Polansky (talk) 12:42, 12 October 2013 (UTC)

Wiktionary:Index to templates/languages/protection/scriptEdit

One more to Speedy delete to keep RFDO looking slim and sexy. Wiktionary:Index to templates/languages/protection/script -WF


Wouldn't this be Paisa? Mglovesfun (talk) 09:27, 30 August 2013 (UTC)

That’s a good question, but I think the answer is no. Paisa doesn’t really refer to a nationality or an ethnicity, so much as it’s a sort of (sub)cultural/social designation. You wouldn’t capitalize redneck or bumpkin, just as you wouldn’t capitalize goth, skater, ese, etc. —Wiki Wikardo 03:18, 21 October 2013 (UTC)


Hinudstani isn't the name of a language on Wiktionary. You can use Hindi or Urdu. Hindi is written in Devanagari script (Wiktionary code {{Deva}}) and Urdu in Arabic script (Wiktionary code {{ur-Arab}}). Oh and Latin script names should never redirect to other scripts as this causes much confusion. Assuming you can, would you like to recreate your entry under this set of rules? Thanks, Mglovesfun (talk) 12:45, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

We've got ishq already: عشق, इश्क़. — [ R·I·C ] Laurent — 19:55, 16 May 2011 (UTC)
If one searches on ishq now and looks around, one can eventually find a link to इश्क़/عشق—however, when posted, that was not the case. But ishq and pyaar, for example, are properly transliterated iśq and pyār; therefore, anyone searching for ubiquitious-but-not-scholarly Latin-alphabet representations will come up empty handed. Is there not some way—analogous to romaji—that we could include—very common—Roman Urdu spellings such as featured on Bollywood posters, television commercials, billboards, etc.? —Wiki Wikardo 03:18, 21 October 2013 (UTC)
I have often thought that we ought to include Romanised Hindi-Urdu and call it Hindustani - but I know that nobody else would ever agree so I keep quiet. SemperBlotto (talk) 10:45, 25 October 2013 (UTC)
Bollywood and adverts sidestep the potentially thorny issue of “Urdu/Hindi” by using the Roman alphabet. We have entries for misspellings; why can’t we include a non-standard, widely used orthography? —Wiki Wikardo 02:18, 28 October 2013 (UTC)
This isn't the place to discuss it, but yes if used that usage should be documented. Presumably not every Hindustani word is found in the Latin script, just some. Hindi/Urdu entries also need to meet WT:CFI#Attestation (specifically three durably archived citations showing usage). Mglovesfun (talk) 09:55, 30 October 2013 (UTC)


Hi there. I can't figure out (from the French Wiktionary entry) what this verb actually means. The word entablature seems like it derives from it - but what are the scissors all about? SemperBlotto (talk) 08:07, 25 October 2013 (UTC)

Nor me to be honest. Can't remember coming across it in a sentence either, though it's very common in Scrabble because of all the common letters. Mglovesfun (talk) 09:25, 25 October 2013 (UTC)
I've added it with an "rfdef" because the inflected forms exist. There are now 23 entries in Category:French definitions needed. SemperBlotto (talk) 10:40, 25 October 2013 (UTC)

Khmer - Sino-KhmerEdit

Many native Khmer pronunciations have been given to Chinese characters, and should be documented as such. If not here in Wiktionary, then where?
推 = ស៊ុយ (suy)
姐 = ចែ (jae)
華 = ហួរ (huor)
Please advise. Have here on Wiktionary, or write a Wikibook?
Thank you ----mexicocamboya

Many native Khmer pronunciations have been given to Chinese characters - in what language though? Are you talking about Khmer being written in Han script, if so can you produce evidence to show that? Or if you're talking about loanword from Khmer into one of the Chinese languages, then that of course is etymology. Mglovesfun (talk) 21:29, 27 October 2013 (UTC)
Asside from the obvious loan words of Chinese origin, in Khmer, Cambodia's official language, especially throughout Chenla period, there were attempts to do so. Unfortunately most detailed records were destroyed by the Khmer Rouge regime, and are conserved chiefly through oral accounts through the monks of the Theravada Buddhist pagodas. I will keep my eyes open for some texts on the subjects in the international communities.
This sort of thing needs wider discussion at Wiktionary:Beer parlour/2013/October‎. Mglovesfun (talk) 12:39, 28 October 2013 (UTC)

aisance (FRM)Edit

What does this term mean in Middle French? --Æ&Œ (talk) 03:03, 30 October 2013 (UTC)

Presumably the same as it means in modern French. Do you have a specific citation in mind? Mglovesfun (talk) 09:36, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
Judging from Google Books, I was thinking that there existed an additional sense: freedom or liberty, but I can’t prove this. --Æ&Œ (talk) 09:48, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
French Wiktionary already has a sense to cover this: "Liberté de corps et d’esprit dans le travail, dans les mouvements, dans les manières, dans le commerce de la vie." Mglovesfun (talk) 09:53, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
I was thinking that it was broader than that. --Æ&Œ (talk) 11:46, 30 October 2013 (UTC)

Does adoubement mean accolade in Middle French? --Æ&Œ (talk) 15:14, 3 November 2013 (UTC)

I can only look it up. Specific citations would help. is a good place to start because it covers the entire Middle French period. Mglovesfun (talk) 18:47, 3 November 2013 (UTC)
Google Books doesn't get any hits for adoubement, they're all for radoubement. Looking into aisement so far, all the hits are adverbial (easily). Mglovesfun (talk) 00:19, 4 November 2013 (UTC)
Try adoubements. --Æ&Œ (talk) 03:02, 4 November 2013 (UTC)
I think the usual interpretation is adornment or decoration. Mglovesfun (talk) 22:53, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Harmful actionEdit

Hi Gloves. Got this messing trying to feed a bot. Any solution?

"This action has been automatically identified as harmful, and therefore disallowed. If you believe your action was constructive, please inform an administrator of what you were trying to do. A brief description of the abuse rule which your action matched is: Users touching other users' user pages and subpages" --ElisaVan (talk) 13:31, 30 October 2013 (UTC)

Nope. Mglovesfun (talk) 13:38, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
OK, no more bot-feeding for me then. One less task! --ElisaVan (talk) 13:49, 30 October 2013 (UTC)

Neanderthal languageEdit Böri (talk) 09:59, 31 October 2013 (UTC)

Interesting, though very preliminary. It does say "However, it might be harder to prove that Neanderthals contributed to specific words in our modern vocabularies." Mglovesfun (talk) 11:10, 31 October 2013 (UTC)

“someone’s screwed this comment up”Edit

Hello Mglovesfun. Re this edit summary of yours, the error was introduced in this edit. It would be easy to correct it by a Replace all of <!—<!-- and —>-->, but I don't think it's obtrusive enough to be worth the bother. — I.S.M.E.T.A. 11:06, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

I am awayEdit

I will be away from this afternoon to the following evening, without computer access. And I work Tuesday morning so I probably won't be online again until Tuesday afternoon. Please be patient with the work MglovesfunBot is doing with English plurals; it's in three steps which means that all 120,461 entries have to be checked three times! Mglovesfun (talk) 12:16, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

French adverb etymologyEdit

Hi there. Should I say that the etymology is masculine adjective plus suffix -ment (as in bêtassement) or feminine (as in adroitement)? Italian, like French, creates them from the feminine adjective, but we use the masculine in etymology sections. Feminine is probably more correct, but masculine is fewer clicks for the user. SemperBlotto (talk) 15:31, 21 November 2013 (UTC)

I would compromise and write the feminine but link to the masculine. --WikiTiki89 15:33, 21 November 2013 (UTC)
I tend to put the feminine. There's also the long-winded way "adroite, feminine of adroit +‎ -ment." I rarely have the patience to do that. Mglovesfun (talk) 15:34, 21 November 2013 (UTC)
Wikitiki89's suggestion is fine too IMO. Mglovesfun (talk) 15:39, 21 November 2013 (UTC)
OK. I have used Wikitiki89's method in capitalement but it is more typing. I'll probably go with using the feminine. SemperBlotto (talk) 15:41, 21 November 2013 (UTC)


Thanks for that. I've requested the Latin etymon. — I.S.M.E.T.A. 10:53, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

I've found a French-Latin dictionary that lists it. Mglovesfun (talk) 13:13, 25 November 2013 (UTC)
Good-oh. I've created the entry; however, I don't know what that "Gaffiot" dictionary is — could you give me or link me to its bibliographical information, please? — I.S.M.E.T.A. 13:35, 25 November 2013 (UTC)


I'm struggling to translate this. The obvious word is geometral but it has more to do with retaining proportions and perspective. This from Larousse:- "Se dit, en géométrie ou en dessin, de ce qui donne les dimensions en vraie grandeur ou en grandeur proportionnelle, sans tenir compte de la perspective." Any ideas? SemperBlotto (talk) 22:31, 25 November 2013 (UTC)

Not really, says something very similar. I don't quite understand why 'without taking into account the perspective' is such an integral part of the definition. If you look at en géométral in the link above. Mglovesfun (talk) 17:02, 26 November 2013 (UTC)
OK. I have added the French, and updated the English to match what usage I can find. SemperBlotto (talk) 08:10, 29 November 2013 (UTC)


You said: "As it stands, all this does it the same thing as {{plural of||lang=st|nocat=1}}, so it's not needed unless you can think of some Sotho-only features." Can I just confirm that I have understood you correctly, and that I can rfd that page, and then replace its usage with what you said? I have already tried the latter, and it seems to do everything I need, as you say. --Winelight (talk) 12:24, 29 November 2013 (UTC)

I could delete it now if you like, it's pretty standard to speedy delete stuff with the creator's consent when a suitable replacement already exists. But, I think you might want to categorize these as Category:Sotho plurals, not as nouns. Mglovesfun (talk) 13:02, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
By all means, yes please go ahead and delete. (But, I would point out that I - erm - "borrowed" the idea from other Bantu languages, so similar plural templates exist elsewhere, possibly unnecessarily, for example Template:xh-plural_of and Template:zu-plural_of.) Now, on your latter point, I've created Category:Sotho_plurals and hopefully got it right? Thanks for all your assistance so far. --Winelight (talk) 14:11, 29 November 2013 (UTC)
They seem to be categorizing plurals as nouns. But why? Is it to do with usage or to get the noun classes in there? I think CodeCat (talkcontribs) might be the one to ask. Mglovesfun (talk) 18:35, 30 November 2013 (UTC)
{{plural of}} categorises words as plural nouns, even though this is not appropriate for most languages. It's really only useful for English. This should be changed, but it would be a lot of work to do this. —CodeCat 18:40, 30 November 2013 (UTC)
Though the idea of switching to noun forms for all languages has been rejected by the community. Anyway, the Zulu and Xhosa words seem to be categorized as nouns, not even noun forms. Mglovesfun (talk) 18:44, 30 November 2013 (UTC)
I'm not talking about changing the name of the category, just removing the categorisation from this template and putting it somewhere else (like the headword). This would bring it in line with other inflection form templates like {{feminine of}} or {{feminine plural of}}, which also don't add categories. In Zulu and Xhosa, plurals are based on noun class: even-numbered classes are plural. So they are categorised by the class, and then the classes are categorised as plurals. Sotho could follow a similar path. —CodeCat 18:48, 30 November 2013 (UTC)
I'm not comfortable with editing templates... so if there's something that needs to be done, there's little point in waiting for me to do it... sorry (unless someone wants to spell it out for me). --Winelight (talk) 21:27, 1 December 2013 (UTC)
I am bringing up ideas more than anything. A template like {{plural of}} can't be changed like that without some kind of consensus. I would like to gauge if there is any support for removing the categorisation (and bot-adding it elsewhere), before I make a proper proposal. —CodeCat 21:59, 1 December 2013 (UTC)
Actually... I don't dislike the idea. It would solve the problem of some languages using noun forms and some languages using plurals by having the categorization outside the template, and inside head (or {{<language>-noun-form}}). Mglovesfun (talk) 22:01, 1 December 2013 (UTC)

rasibus / razibusEdit

Hmm. Yet another French word that I'm struggling with. Also, I can see lots of mentions but very few actual usages. Do you think you could have a go? (if you think it's worth it) SemperBlotto (talk) 17:31, 30 November 2013 (UTC)

Never heard of them, so all I could do is look them up. Mglovesfun (talk) 18:43, 30 November 2013 (UTC)


I have no idea if that sense is real. Just that isn't how we delete things; we use {{rfv-sense}}. It does claim to be archaic so it might be real. I'll try and find who added it. Mglovesfun (talk) 12:17, 2 December 2013 (UTC)

It was added by Vahagn Petrosyan, so could be complete nonsense. Mglovesfun (talk) 12:22, 2 December 2013 (UTC)
You're a complete nonsense. It's in OED "Applied to any one having qualities attributed to the Turks; a cruel, rigorous, or tyrannical man; any one behaving as a barbarian or savage; one who treats his wife hardly; a bad-tempered or unmanageable man" with quotes going back from modern times to 1536. --Vahag (talk) 13:01, 2 December 2013 (UTC)
If you don't mind if I say that: The old litarature for example ansiklopedia britanicca says that Turks mean "order", "sober", "self dsiplinied". After the Ottoman Empire some Armanians such as in this case Petrosyan and other say nonsense definitions for propaganda reson. It ıs not true. I think this addition is JUST PROPOGANDA and HOSTtility... We don't need hostility and propoganda --[[Resim:Peace.gif|25px]][[User:3210|<span style="color:white;background:red;">&nbsp;3210&nbsp;</span>]] <sup><font size="-2">[[User talk:3210|(T)]]</font></sup> (talk) 14:04, 2 December 2013 (UTC)



I made my edits because there is a real distinction between "to persuade" -- to change someone's mind or induce someone to do something -- and "to convince" -- to bring someone to the belief that something is true. Unfortunately, this distinction is being lost, precisely because a number of people use the terms interchangeably now. In doing so, they're destroying a useful difference between the two words, and thereby, diminishing the richness and subtlety of our language. For instance, saying "I was like" is a synonym for "I said", doesn't reflect what most people would regard as correct usage. Just because many people say "I was like" when most people would accept that they really mean "I said", doesn't make "I was like" a proper exemplar of English usage! This "persuade/convince" distinction does appear to be a losing battle though, so I think those who, like me, seek to uphold the clarity and beauty of language -- and to maintain this site as an exemplar of correct usage, not as a mere mirror of (to a limited extent) popular usage -- are ending up on the losing side. A pity for English. Good wishes to you!

Well we're not an exemplar of correct English, that's just not our purpose. Though we do have tags such as {{context|nonstandard}} and so on for the reasons you give. However it seems to me that persuade and convince are synonyms under most circumstances. Synonym doesn't means 'always a synonym no matter what the context' but more like 'synonymous in some contexts'. Having said that, difficult to think of an example where convince and persuade don't carry the same meaning. Mglovesfun (talk) 17:38, 10 December 2013 (UTC)

branche d'oliveEdit

What's the source on this, out of interest? I was under the impression that ‘olive branch’ (as a symbol of peace) was raim d'olivier in Old French (modern rameau d'olivier). Ƿidsiþ 15:36, 10 December 2013 (UTC)

Whatever I was reading at the time. June 2010, would be Marie de France or La Chanson de Roland probably. Not sure if I'd got any further than that at that time. Mglovesfun (talk) 17:08, 10 December 2013 (UTC)
Ta. Ƿidsiþ 17:13, 10 December 2013 (UTC)

Re: InterwikisEdit

Yes, but AFAIK bots need at least one interwiki to add the others; usually when I write a new entry on it.wiktionary I add the relative interwiki there and here on en.wikt, to help bots' work... but if you really think this is improper, I will stop (the truth is, I can't wait for wikidata's functionalities to be extended to wiktionary^^) --Barbaking (talk) 23:06, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

Maybe on the Italian Wiktionary they need one, but not here, no. Mglovesfun (talk) 23:21, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

aillors ailleursEdit

Quel adverbe ancien français est plus commun ? --Æ&Œ (talk) 19:22, 24 December 2013 (UTC)

The Anglo-Norman On-Line Hub gives aillors as more common than ailleurs, and aillurs as more common than both. But the numbers aren't always reliable because some the some citation is found in more than one reference, and it counted twice. It actually gives 28 different forms of it. Mglovesfun (talk) 19:28, 24 December 2013 (UTC)
Je crois que devrions faire la forme plus commune le lemme. Es‐tu d’accord, monsieur? --Æ&Œ (talk) 19:38, 24 December 2013 (UTC)
Anglo-Norman Hub, I think anyway, only counts attestations from Great Britain. So it ignores France! Though in general the simple answer is 'yes', but it's a bit of a waste of time trying to find out which is the most common. Anglo-Norman Hub is handy in that it gives you a number. Mglovesfun (talk) 19:43, 24 December 2013 (UTC)

Can you show me an example of an Old French reflexive verb, preferably one that already has a conjugation table? --Æ&Œ (talk) 21:08, 24 December 2013 (UTC)

You mean a table with all the pronouns in it? There isn't one on Wiktionary. I think all the pronouns are the same as the modern ones with minor variations (vos for vous, nos for nous). They use estre but the subject pronoun is usually not used, so « je me lève » becomes « me lieve ». The elided forms of me, te and se are optional before a vowel, so, « s'entramoient » or « se entramoient » for 'they loved each other'. The conjugation gives away whether it's third person singular or plural. Mglovesfun (talk) 21:56, 24 December 2013 (UTC)
Entramer is an excellent example actually. Mglovesfun (talk) 21:57, 24 December 2013 (UTC)
On reflection, adding a reflexive parameter to the current conjugation templates is better than writing all new templates just to get the pronouns in there, but with the same conjugation! Mglovesfun (talk) 13:53, 25 December 2013 (UTC)


Any criticisms or suggestions? --Æ&Œ (talk) 01:29, 26 December 2013 (UTC)

Well, amer is irregular because the usual first-persons singular present indicative is aim, whence the French aimer. I suppose entreparler (if it exists, and I'm going to say it does) would be perfectly regular first conjugation. Like I say, creating totally new templates seems like madness when we have ones that do the conjugation fine but as yet don't support reflexiveness. Admittedly what you're linking to is the Spanish Wiktionary where the situation isn't the same. Mglovesfun (talk) 21:31, 26 December 2013 (UTC)
I could use your templates, but they would have to be modified. They lack reflexion (as you said), elaborate compound tenses and they’re in the stupid rosbif language. Even if I did modify them, I predict that somebody is going to whine about copyright violations. By the way, I slightly modified my sandbox again, if you are interested. --Æ&Œ (talk) 05:55, 27 December 2013 (UTC)
Looks good. Mglovesfun (talk) 12:33, 27 December 2013 (UTC)
Have a look at entreparler, I'm not so convinced myself. Mglovesfun (talk) 13:09, 27 December 2013 (UTC)


Oh, my friend, what makes you think there is no article about the word outlet in the Finnish Wiktionary? -- 17:47, 27 December 2013 (UTC)

Nothing, just you put the interwiki in the wrong place, therefore if I revert a bot will add it in the right place. Hey, at least we're friends. Mglovesfun (talk) 22:24, 27 December 2013 (UTC)
It actually was in the right place: fi is alphabetized as 'Suomi' (the Finnish word for Finnish). Also, the bots do check for straightforward cases of out-of-order interwiki-links. (Not a big deal, just an FYI.) —RuakhTALK 00:23, 9 January 2014 (UTC)

Molotov variantsEdit

I have no idea how you do things around here, but demanding a formal "deletion" of an unsupported definition seems very obstinate. I've tried to use the talkpage, so please return the favor.

Peter Isotalo 18:16, 29 December 2013 (UTC)

You don't have the authority to decide what is 'supported' or not. I will nominate the definition myself now. Mglovesfun (talk) 18:54, 29 December 2013 (UTC)
Apparently, the idea that my "entire argument is flawed" isn't shared by others. I assume that bothers you as little as the part about "Tricky issues" (maybe it's just too close to Wikipedia policy for your taste). But I suppose that you genuinely believed that a 3-day block was all that stood in the way of more rampant "vandalism" on my part and that you really were capoable of calling out bad faith as you saw it.
If you feel like deleting more of my posts, I've made one at WT:RFD#Molotov cocktail. 07:48, 30 December 2013 (UTC) (Peter Isotalo)
You're missing the point. What you're actually asking for is to not be subject to the same rules as everyone else. It's very bad form to remove a definition unilaterally unless it's patent nonsense. WT:BLOCK is satisfied in that you were harming Wiktionary (it doesn't have to be intention, just harm) and that communication was unlikely to succeed on the grounds I'd already tried it and it didn't work. Again, in your next comment, tell me why you shouldn't be subject to the same rules as everyone else? Mglovesfun (talk) 18:56, 30 December 2013 (UTC)
I love how you're all preachy to me about the "same rules as everyone else" about handing out a purely punitive block for "vandalism" you made because you literally didn't want to communicate. Good work on establishing credibility! :-D 01:52, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
And it's pretty amusing how you're telling me all this while I'm actively avoiding the block you meted out. As if your anger-blocking actually saved you any time or put a stop to any "vandalism". All because simply explaining yourself seemed a bit too taxing... 02:07, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
You're just changing the subject to avoid answering the question. Mglovesfun (talk) 12:28, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
You, know I tried actually telling you that I didn't understand your rules and was expecting to be directed to some kind of policy page. Why the Hell else would I actually use the RfD from beyond the block? Your reaction was to reply with a declaration of bad faith and insisting that detailed rules are for someone like me to watch out for and for someone like you to interpret at your leisure.
Just think a little what it means when you block someone without engaging dialogue.
Peter Isotalo 16:01, 2 January 2014 (UTC)

"Never take a Purplebackpack89 comment as an informed contribution"Edit

I have reverted this edit as a blatent and completely uncalled for personal attack. I am entitled to my opinions as much as you are, and my opinions should carry the same weight as yours. Whether or not a mushroom cloud is made of mushrooms is quite germane to whether or not an additional definition is needed or not Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 17:56, 8 January 2014 (UTC)

From Wiktionary:No personal attacks, "Never suggest a view is invalid simply because of who its proponent is." You should be ashamed Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 18:00, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
I stand by this, my statement is factual and therefore I couldn't go back on it without lying. Mglovesfun (talk) 18:05, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
Wiktionary:No personal attacks only applies to personal attacks, and this isn't one. The fact you don't like it doesn't make it a personal attack. Mglovesfun (talk) 18:07, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
I consider your reversion a personal attack on me. Mglovesfun (talk) 18:09, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
How? I didn't say anything about you. Your comment paints with far too broad a brush, as it's essentially saying that anything I say is invalid. The clause from NPA says that comments like that can be construed as personal attacks. Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 18:13, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
  • Please do not edit war to make personal attacks. Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 18:16, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
    It was not a personal attack because it was not an attack at all. --WikiTiki89 18:33, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
    I still find the comment completely unsubstantiated, highly inappropriate, and in general worthy of carrying no weight. I have as much say in RfDs as he does. If he doesn't like that I want to keep some things, well, that's just too bad. Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 18:35, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
    User:Wikitiki89, how do you reconcile his comments with the clause of Wiktionary:No personal attacks, "Never suggest a view is invalid simply because of who its proponent is." He is suggesting that all past and future views I made are invalid simply because I said them. Therefore, a personal attack Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 18:37, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
    Not if you interpret it as hyperbole. --WikiTiki89 18:42, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
    If I had said something to that effect about Mglovesfun, I'd have been blocked. He shouldn't make a comment that can be interpreted as a personal attack even if he's joking Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 19:01, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
  • Mglovesfun's comment was rude, but it was actually pretty good advice. People were wasting their time and energy replying to your nonsense, and trying to do so without being rude. They shouldn't have bothered, and Mglovesfun was just pointing that out.
    Would you have preferred "Don't feed the Purplebackback89"?
    RuakhTALK 19:20, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
    • I would have preferred no comment, frankly, and just let my "Keep" vote stand as one man's belief that something shouldn't be deleted Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 19:57, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
Purplebackpack89, you are banned from my talk page for harassment. The slightest further hint of harassment and I will indefintely block you as a harassment-only account. Mglovesfun (talk) 21:31, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
Was that block really necessary? I mean, I don't disagree with you, but CodeCat just got called out for blocking on his own as an involved party, and we should really give a good example and not resort to the very same behavior. It makes us look kind of silly otherwise. -- Liliana 22:41, 8 January 2014 (UTC)
I agree. And I think the threat of a unilateral indefblock is completely out of line. —RuakhTALK 00:18, 9 January 2014 (UTC)
'Was that block really necessary?' I can't really think of another solution. On that grounds, both necessary and regrettable. I'm not seeing anyone coming up with alternatives. Mglovesfun (talk) 16:44, 9 January 2014 (UTC)
I blocked Dan Polansky on the grounds of self-defense against harassment before. I won't hesitate to do so again. Well actually I'll hesitate but ultimately I will only allow myself to be pushed around so much. If such self-defense blocks are deemed invalid, then I'll be leaving all together. I don't want to be a sitting duck for abuse. Mglovesfun (talk) 16:50, 9 January 2014 (UTC)
Abuse? Harassment? Indef? Excuse me, but I'm the one being abused here. If me asking you to not abuse me is abuse, then you saying all my RfD comments are invalid is also abuse. And blocking me (a block several other editors have taken issue with), that was pretty clearly abuse. And there's a pretty simple solution that gives us both what we want: interaction ban. I don't comment on your talk page, and you don't blast me on RfD, my talk page or anywhere else. It allows you and me both to continue actions with other editors unabated. (Note that in unblocking me, Equinox expressed the opinion that an admin MUST have his talk page open to comment from all parties). Purplebackpack89 (Notes Taken) (Locker) 16:58, 9 January 2014 (UTC)
You're impossible. Any attempt to communicate with you in a rational manner you dismiss it as harassment, making you effectively immune from all criticism. Effectively 'godlike', immune to the rule, impervious, impotent. What's the fucking point when the minority can waltz in, destroy the wiki and simply refuse to participate in any discussions no matter how reasonable. Perhaps I will just refuse to communicate with people no matter how reasonable they are and see how they like it. Now piss off. Mglovesfun (talk) 22:18, 9 January 2014 (UTC)

you'll be back soonEdit

Really, you will. And I might have to invite you over to Spain some day. --Back on the list (talk) 10:44, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

These ‘im leavin 4eva’ charades almost never succeed. He avoids it for a while, then he becomes bored, then irritated, then crazy, and pretty soon he comes crawling back like an alcoholic to a liquor store. --Æ&Œ (talk) 11:40, 14 January 2014 (UTC)

In your memory, I shall dedicate February's competition to you. I hope you can participate. If not, I shall play in your stead. --Back on the list (talk) 16:04, 31 January 2014 (UTC)


Is this tag still needed now? --kc_kennylau (talk) 11:34, 15 February 2014 (UTC)


formatting French gender for pluralsEdit

I have no idea how this edit has improved Wiktionary. I have no way to track the plurals and add the genders one by one. --kc_kennylau (talk) 12:37, 29 April 2014 (UTC)

reverted editEdit

Hi Mglovesfun, You have removed one edit by me. ( Can you please tell me the reason for it?☆★Sanjeev Kumar (talk) 15:55, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Interwiki links are used to link to the same word in other Wiktionaries, not for translations. — Ungoliant (falai) 01:26, 23 September 2014 (UTC)

Formatting Old English adjective formsEdit

Would you mind checking out yfela and yfelum and letting me know if I created them properly?--Brett (talk) 13:29, 7 November 2014 (UTC)

It looks ok, although there is no need to use sc=Latinx as this is done automatically. And also no need to include the "Old English adjective forms" category explicitly, as the {{head}} template already adds this. —CodeCat 14:39, 7 November 2014 (UTC)


Does this need an entry? (Does it even exist?) - I have just added protofrancese. SemperBlotto (talk) 14:34, 29 January 2015 (UTC)

Proposal to de-sysop/de-checkuser Connel MacKenzieEdit

Since you participated in the the 2012 vote to de-sysop and de-checkuser Connel MacKenzie, you may wish to participate in the current discussion of this proposal. Cheers! bd2412 T 17:00, 7 April 2015 (UTC)

Declension of Old French avogleEdit

Is it confirmed? --kc_kennylau (talk) 13:11, 11 March 2016 (UTC)

@kc kennylau: nobody uses this page any more. Try user talk:Renard Migrant, you’ll get a response there. --Romanophile (contributions) 13:27, 11 March 2016 (UTC)
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