User talk:Eric Kvaalen
This word comes from Modern Greek? Are you sure? Also, please see WT:ELE for our page layout and section order. The Etymology should be added at the top of an entry. --EncycloPetey 13:48, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
- I didn't say it was from Modern Greek! Eric Kvaalen (talk) 05:17, 22 January 2013 (UTC)
@Romanophile Thanks for the link. But I'm not convinced that the august professor and his son are right, for the following reasons:
1. They say that "whore" was pronounced with no "h" sound. On what basis? It certainly had the "h" sound in Old English, and it has it now. If it lost the sound in Early Modern English, then why did it gain it back again? I think the only words with silent "h" are words of Latin origin, usually coming to English through French. "Whore" is not one of those words.
2. They say that "hour" was pronounced like "or". Well, in Middle English it was something like /urə/, and in Modern English it's /aʊə(ɹ)/. Just like many other words, the /u/ changed to /aʊ/. There's no reason to think that it passed through /ɔ/. If it had been pronounced like "or", then why would "or" and "hour" be pronounced different today?
In fact, one can ask the same question about "whore" and "hour". If they were pronounced the same back in Shakespeare's time, then why are they now pronounced different, reflecting in each case the Middle English pronunciation?
It seems to me that the only argument they have is that they think it makes a bad joke in "As You Like It" Act 2 Scene 7 if you pronounce the two words the same.
Eric Kvaalen (talk) 05:50, 7 April 2016 (UTC)
- For the aspiration, see  & . For the vowel, look at this (page 27) and compare it with this (page 63). --Romanophile ♞ (contributions) 07:29, 7 April 2016 (UTC)
- @Romanophile Your first link says that sometimes people would drop the h at the beginning of words, but usually when they were unstress'd. Your second link gives two more examples of it. Probably even today a Cockney would say "or" for "whore". But that certainly doesn't mean that it was the usual pronunciation. Your next two links are to two lines from Act 5 Scene 2 of "Loves Labors Lost":
- We foure in-deed confronted were with foure
- In Rußian habit: heere they ſtay'd an houre,
- (The two links are practically the same.) Well, it could just be a bad rhyme. We would need to do a study of all the words that Shakespeare rhymes with "hour", and all the words that he rhymes with "four", in order to know whether these two words really rhymed in his time. Again, I don't think so, because they didn't rhyme earlier and they don't rhyme now.
- If Shakespeare really wanted to make a bawdy joke in "As You Like It", why would he spell the word as "hour" all four times, when two of them are supposedly meant to be "whore"?
- Eric Kvaalen (talk) 17:32, 8 April 2016 (UTC)
- For  sakes, are you going to keep making excuses every time I present new evidence to you?
- Also, the reason why ‘houre’ was spelt ‘hour’ is because the text was updated by another author, AND the Google page only shows two results because the workers at Google are incompetent. Go to this page and look up ‘16.’ If I knew that you were going to keep making excuses not to include a dialectal variant, I would have just left your revisions alone. --Romanophile ♞ (contributions) 20:07, 8 April 2016 (UTC)