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Enjoy your stay at Wiktionary! --Apisite (talk) 09:51, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

Apisite, Thanks! ive been editing wiki for quite some time now AleksiB 1945 (talk) 09:54, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

Malayalam and GoateeBoiEdit

GoateeBoi (talkcontribs) has an interest in adding Malayalam words. Do you have that interest also? --Apisite (talk) 09:52, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

@Apisite, I can add Mal words if you want but what kinds of words specifically? AleksiB 1945 (talk) 09:56, 22 January 2021 (UTC)
At least words like സഭ (as in സര്‍വശക്തനായ ദൈവത്തിന്‍റെ സഭ, or The Church of Almighty God), or any words you deem necessary to add. --Apisite (talk) 09:59, 22 January 2021 (UTC)
Also, there's Wiktionary:Requested entries (Malayalam). --Apisite (talk) 10:42, 22 January 2021 (UTC)
Add the requested entries for Malayalam to your watchlist. --Apisite (talk) 11:12, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

MalayalamEdit

I've noticed a few problems in some entries you've created...For one, you defined വഞ്ചിക്കുക as "to cheat", but the entry says it's a noun. Surely it's a verb, right? Also, Wiktionary entry titles are case sensitive and pretty much all nonproper nouns should have a lowercase initial letter. Finally, you created an entry recently which you defined as meaning "enough", but again you entered it as a noun. "Enough" is not a noun except in a rare sense which I doubt you meant, so that entry needs to be fixed too. User: The Ice Mage talk to meh 22:06, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

You're still making the same mistakes as in the past. You need to be more careful with spelling words in definitions correctly, capitalising words when appropriate, and putting the correct part of speech. For example, you defined കൊച്ചു as an adjective, but you have called it a noun. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 22:44, 3 September 2021 (UTC)

Mass-creation of Sanskrit entriesEdit

Please don't mass-create Sanskrit entries. They are messed up and have incorrect formatting. Thanks for understanding. —Svārtava2 • 05:02, 3 September 2021 (UTC)

ChilluEdit

Hi, the claim [1][2], "In Malayalam, words can only end with [m] [n] [ɳ] [r] [l] and [ɭ]" is not true. I think you missed some words. It just never occur as the first letter of any Malayalam word.

By the way, I am also a Malayalam native speaker. Nice to meet you! Vis M (talk) 19:58, 11 September 2021 (UTC)

പഴഞ്ചൻEdit

You're making POS-related mistakes again...you say this is a noun, but the definition, "obsolete", is an adjective or, perhaps more rarely, a verb. So, which is it? 37.110.218.43 13:48, 22 February 2022 (UTC)

Seems to be fixed now :) Prahlad balaji (talk) 18:08, 22 February 2022 (UTC)

Translating The Little Lotus StoryEdit

Would you like this new fairy tale translated into Malayalam? --Apisite (talk) 11:55, 29 March 2022 (UTC)

Translate it to wiktionary? AleksiB 1945 (talk) 14:13, 29 March 2022 (UTC)
If you would like to help translate it, then it says on the website: For any issues concerning cooperation or usage of materials from this site, write to myfairylotus@gmail.com --Apisite (talk) 14:22, 29 March 2022 (UTC)

Appendix:Tamil Swadesh listEdit

I created the bare minimum to get this working, but that's all I can do without learning Tamil. Chuck Entz (talk) 01:23, 3 April 2022 (UTC)

@Chuck Entz I'm working on it. Prahlad balaji (talk) 19:08, 14 April 2022 (UTC)

ഇംഗ്ലീഷ് (iṅglīṣŭ)Edit

This entry had two parts of speech, proper noun and (probably mistakenly) noun— I've changed the latter to adjective. Please verify the change. Thanks. ·~ dictátor·mundꟾ 22:18, 4 April 2022 (UTC)

ലളിതംEdit

Hi, is ലളിതം (laḷitaṃ) a noun or adjective? Prahlad balaji (talk) 16:55, 23 April 2022 (UTC)

@Prahlad balaji yes an adjective it was a typo AleksiB 1945 (talk) 14:15, 25 April 2022 (UTC)
OK, thank you! Prahlad balaji (talk) 19:35, 25 April 2022 (UTC)

Edit

I noticed that "The 16th letter of the Tamil alphabet, called ஜ (ja). Represents voiced postalveolar affricate: [d͡ʒ]. Transliterated as j." was changed to just "The fourth consonant in Tamil." As I added in hidden text, I only found sources that contradicts this. However, I literally started learning Tamil 9 days ago and am thus unsure how to correct the page or if the page needs correction. — Fredrick Campbell (talk) 09:30, 5 May 2022 (UTC)

@AleksiB 1945:@DerekWinters:@Emmanuel Asbon:@Goldenbrook:@Hk5183:@Info-farmer:@NeṭuMāran:@Prahlad balaji:@Zovlon:@エリック・キィ:Calling for attention to this. By the way, is currently listed as the fifth consonant, the sixth, the seventh, and the eighth. What I have found contradicts this but I would like to ask for verification of my sources found on 's hidden text. — Fredrick Campbell (talk) 09:51, 5 May 2022 (UTC)
@Fredrick Campbell Hi. Most Brahmic scripts list consonants by the way they are pronounced, from frontmost to backmost in your mouth. E.g. ' (ka)' (frontmost) to ' (ha)' (backmost). As ' (ja)' is near the front of the mouth, it would be at the beginning of the alphabet; therefore, the assertion that it is in 4th position would be technically correct.
However, since ' (ja)' is mostly only ever used in loanwords, it is usually placed at the end of the alphabet with other consonants like ' (ha)', ' (ṣa)', ' (śa)', ' (sa)', etc. in contrast to the letters that are used in native words. Prahlad balaji (talk) 13:18, 5 May 2022 (UTC)
@Fredrick Campbell Hi, I've only ever seen this type of placement in online sources alone. Maybe it is like that to keep it identical with other Indic scripts for quick learning, since speakers of other Indian languages are more familiar with that style of arrangement. But, to this day, the way it's taught in schools and strictly practiced by Tamil speakers looks like this,
உயிரெழுத்துக்கள் (uyireḻuttukkaḷ, vowels or soul letters): அ, ஆ, இ, ஈ, உ, ஊ, எ, ஏ, ஐ, ஒ, ஓ, ஐ (a, ā, i, ī, u, ū, e, ē, ai, o, ō, ai)
------
ஆய்த எழுத்து (āyta eḻuttu): () (this is a special letter which in Old/Middle Tamil was used inbetween short vowels and hard consonants, but in modern Tamil, it is used as a prefix combined with specific consonants to make, f(ஃப), z(ஃஜ), kh(ஃக) sounds. On its own, it sounds like 'ugh' or 'ah')
------
மெய்யெழுத்துக்கள் (meyyeḻuttukkaḷ, consonants or body letters): க், ங், ச், ஞ், ட், ண், த், ந், ப், ம், ய், ர், ல், வ், ழ், ள், ற், ன் (k, ṅ, c, ñ, ṭ, ṇ, t, n, p, m, y, r, l, v, ḻ, ḷ, ṟ, ṉ)
------
உயிர்மெய் எழுத்துக்கள் (uyirmey eḻuttukkaḷ, alphasyllabic letters or living letters) க, ங, ச, ஞ, ட, ண, த, ந, ப, ம, ய, ர, ல, வ, ழ, ள, ற, ன (ka, ṅa, ca, ña, ṭa, ṇa, ta, na, pa, ma, ya, ra, la, va, ḻa, ḷa, ṟa, ṉa)
------
வடமொழி எழுத்துக்கள் (vaṭamoḻi eḻuttukkaḷ, letters from the northern tongue): ஷ, ஶ, ஸ, ஜ, ஹ, க்ஷ (ṣa, śa, sa, ja, ha, kṣa) (native Tamil words do not need these letters, and since all these letters are a later addition, they're always placed in a seperate category.)
--
Unlike other indic scripts, Tamil consonants doesn't inherently have the 'a' vowel sound in them. This is how letters are categorised in Tamil and this is how it's taught in every institution that teaches Tamil. And this is how I was taught in my school. Also, if someone asks a Tamil person how many letters are there in Tamil, their reply would be 247 (that is with all the vowels, consonants and the alphasyllabic letters including and excluding the northern letters) and some people don't even know what northern letters are, that is because people simply replace these sounds with the closest native sounds, ex: ச replaces ஷ ஶ ஸ ஜ and க replaces ஹ. I hope this clarifies your doubt regarding the placement of ஜ. Emmanuel Asbon (talk) 14:50, 5 May 2022 (UTC)
@Prahlad balaji:@Emmanuel Asbon: Thank you. I'm not too sure how to edit it so that it reflects the reality more accurately, but I'm considering. "One of the letters in the வடமொழி எழுத்துக்கள் (vaṭamoḻi eḻuttukkaḷ, letters from the northern tongue)." If this is fine, I would start to edit some of the letters in the series over the next few days. — Fredrick Campbell (talk) 03:57, 6 May 2022 (UTC)
@Fredrick Campbell fine with me. Emmanuel Asbon (talk) 04:13, 6 May 2022 (UTC)
Sure! I think that would be a great idea, as long as you give a little explanation to people not familiar to it. Prahlad balaji (talk) 17:23, 6 May 2022 (UTC)
@Prahlad balaji:@Emmanuel Asbon: I'm considering changing "letters" to "Tamil consonants" as that is how Wikipedia's page on Tamil Script and suganthinadar.wordpress.com phrases it. I plan on doing but I may take some time. — Fredrick Campbell (talk) 10:35, 8 May 2022 (UTC)
@Fredrick Campbell I think that would be fine, as long as you don't do the aytam and vowels. Prahlad balaji (talk) 16:54, 8 May 2022 (UTC)
@Fredrick Campbell hi, that's fine. I simply translated what it meant. You can change it to make it more relevant for English. Emmanuel Asbon (talk) 13:58, 9 May 2022 (UTC)

Malayalam suffixesEdit

Hi. Actually, I am not sure how to handle suffixes for Malayalam. While definitions in entries for -ക്കുക and -അം are correct, I don't know what should be the proper representation of the suffix. -ഉക is a more accurate suffix for present tense of verb (as in ചാടുക, പാടുക, etc.)

As there are several important suffixes and they play a vital role in Malayalam grammar, I think we should represent them in a standard format. I will check about it and inform you. Thank you. Vis M (talk) 04:25, 10 May 2022 (UTC)

@Vis M, should it be listed under alternative forms? there is also -വുക alternating with -കുക like in പോകുക~പോവുക AleksiB 1945 (talk) 08:58, 10 May 2022 (UTC)
Yes. Also, this happens because the letter "ക" gets replaced by "വ" and sometime "മ" in certain Malayalam words when it occurs at the middle or end. e.g., ചുവപ്പ് - ചുകപ്പ് - ചുമപ്പ്; കൂകൽ - കൂവൽ, etc Vis M (talk) 20:10, 10 May 2022 (UTC)

Do not create redirectsEdit

Hi, see "Wiktionary:Redirections" for acceptable uses of redirects. Unlike Wikipedia, Wiktionary do not use redirects for synonyms, misspellings or root forms of lemmas. e.g., മേഘ should not be redirected to മേഘം. For other policies and guidelines, you can check out "Category:Wiktionary policies". Thank you. Vis M (talk) 06:37, 22 May 2022 (UTC)

Adjective suffixesEdit

Regarding this, the endings are correct, but I am not sure how to proceed with them. I think we have to look more deeply about it and find what the standard form for representing Malayalam adjective formation is. See also the participial adjective of English. Thanks. Vis M (talk) 14:16, 24 May 2022 (UTC)

@Vis_M, where can you check words and suffixes? and in [3] how do search the word? and there are some suffixes for which i am not sure of the meaning like -വ്‌ as in pithaavu raajaavu and nilaavu, i once heard its epenthesis but if it was it wouldnt be in multiple words in a uniform way right, another version of -പ്പ് like in thanuppu? AleksiB 1945 (talk) 15:27, 6 June 2022 (UTC)

Sanskrit entriesEdit

Please stop hastily creating Sanskrit entries without checking. There are multiple good sources so please do your research and don't feel the need to guess. Best -- Prahlad balaji (talk) 16:39, 26 May 2022 (UTC)

അച്ചായൻEdit

Regarding അച്ചായൻ, check out w:ml:അച്ചായൻ article on Malayalam Wikipedia. It is used to refer to Syrian Christian men of Kerala. Same with ഇച്ചായൻ (ml:ഇച്ചായൻ). Thanks. Vis M (talk) 10:26, 5 June 2022 (UTC)

About ஃEdit

Hi, the letter () is been in use since the time of Old Tamil, but it was not called aytam then, it was known as mupparpulli meaning 'three dots.' It is mentioned as part of the Tamil alphabet in Tolkappiyam which is the oldest known Tamil grammar book till date. Emmanuel Asbon (talk) 16:01, 10 July 2022 (UTC)

@Emmanuel Asbon, yea but in modern Tamil its only used to write foreign sounds like ஃப (fa) right? I meant the old Tamil way of using it between a vowel and a consonant like in பஃது (paḥtu) was it used like that in Middle Tamil? AleksiB 1945 (talk) 14:10, 11 July 2022 (UTC)
The old usage is still practiced, not so prevalent you could say. Words like அஃது (aḥtu), இஃது (iḥtu), எஃது (eḥtu) are still used in formal and literary Tamil. Emmanuel Asbon (talk) 11:21, 17 July 2022 (UTC)
Hi, I removed ['t͡ɕ'] = 't͡ɕː', from ta-IPA module, since it's producing /t͡ɕuːɾijaɡaːn̪d̪i/, [t͡ɕuːɾijɐɡɑːn̪d̪i] instead of /t͡ɕuːɾijaɡaːn̪d̪i/, [suːɾijɐɡɑːn̪d̪i]. Emmanuel Asbon (talk) 11:23, 17 July 2022 (UTC)
@Emmanuel Asbon, I meant to make ச்ச as [t͡ɕː] because it was showing as [s:] before but the code got messed up (iirc even in spoken Tamil ச்ச doesnt become [s:] right?) AleksiB 1945 (talk) 11:43, 17 July 2022 (UTC)
Yes, that's correct. ஸ்ஸ produces /s:/ sound and ச்ச produces /t͡ɕː/. Emmanuel Asbon (talk) 13:31, 17 July 2022 (UTC)
@‪AleksiB 1945‬ sorry, my bad. I tagged you in an edit by mistake. Emmanuel Asbon (talk) 20:13, 21 July 2022 (UTC)

Regarding -கைEdit

Hi, as far as I know, there is no such suffix as கை in Tamil. Even in the words where this letter is present, it is not necessarily a suffix, you can simply assume that it gives a complete form to the word, which would otherwise sound incomplete or dangling.

To give it with an example, take a look at this word: எண்ணு (eṇṇu, to think, count, recollect) ⬇️ எண்ணி (eṇṇi), translates to 'think and' or 'count and.' ⬇️ எண்ணிக்கை (eṇṇikkai), translates to 'count, estimation.' Emmanuel Asbon (talk) 08:51, 27 July 2022 (UTC)

वीज्Edit

FYI, I did search further but I don't find anything convincing because I don't know the languages. Mayrhofer for one does mention a possible influence from Dravidian. I am not sure if that makes for a reliable reference, because he presents the idea as someone else's. He himself prefers contraction from वि- and some verbal root, which was maybe contaminated with Dravidian. That seems possible if the word is not vedic, attested as early as 5th century AD epic poetry.

I can get you a copy of Mayrhofer's entry and another dictionary if you need it. ApisAzuli (talk) 11:02, 19 August 2022 (UTC)