User talk:ZxxZxxZ

kälämbär, kälämburEdit

Hi, Z. I am looking for an Azerbaijani word found in the Azerbaijani Salmas dialect, given by Ačaṙean as kälämbär, kälämbur and meaning “aspen” or “poplar”. It is a cognate of կաղամախ ‎(kałamax). For Iranian Azerbaijani I have found this dictionary: İsmail Cəfərli Azərbaycan sözlüyü, 2013, which is either an Azeri–Persian dictionary (or an Azeri–Azeri, not sure). I have extracted two pages from it, starting with k and q, which include similar-sounding words. Here: http://rghost.net/8m58tDmT8. I can't read Persian. Can you look if any of the words there are tree names? qələmbək looks like a tree name. --Vahag (talk) 16:15, 30 July 2015 (UTC)

Hi. It is Azer-Azeri, but also with one-word definitions in Persian for some entries. I found کلنبوُر ‎(kələmbur) (it mentions کلمپور ‎(kələmpur) [transliteration mine] as a by-form) and has translated it into Tilia and نمدار ‎(namdâr), also meaning "Tilia", and the widely used قلمه ‎(qələmə) (also borrowed in Persian), which translates to "poplar". I couldn't find anything similar by googling, except this news page which is talking about smuggling of tress "known as "کلن بر" ‎(kalan/m bar) which are from the family of poplar" in Urmia. --Z 17:47, 30 July 2015 (UTC)
Sorry to intrude, but what about this? Recep Albayrak Hacaloğlu, Azeri Türkçesi dil kilavuzu [1]? Kaixinguo~enwiktionary (talk) 22:18, 30 July 2015 (UTC)
I can't view the relevant sections. How is kelembur defined there? --Vahag (talk) 17:53, 31 July 2015 (UTC)
It says: => GÖYGALEME. Sorry, I have tried to work it out or to see more but I don't know a single word of Azeri. It could well be something totally unrelated. Kaixinguo~enwiktionary (talk) 10:18, 1 August 2015 (UTC)
Hmmm, that's probably göy ‎(blue) and the qələmə that Z mentioned above. So your discovery was very much relevant, thank you. --Vahag (talk) 11:38, 1 August 2015 (UTC)
I only found it because User:ZxxZxxZ gave the word 'kələmbur' above. Kaixinguo~enwiktionary (talk) 10:20, 2 August 2015 (UTC)
Thanks, that's exactly what I was looking for. --Vahag (talk) 17:53, 31 July 2015 (UTC)

ebruEdit

Do you know anything about this etymology of this word? DTLHS (talk) 17:41, 22 August 2015 (UTC)

I presume it comes from ابری ‎(abri, cloudy). —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 20:08, 22 August 2015 (UTC)
Yes, it's ابری, I've expanded the corresponding entries. --Z 16:32, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

نویسه‌های بین‌المللیEdit

سلام. شما راهکار بهتری سراغ دارید؟ 4nn1l2 (talk) 16:01, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
سلام، در نسخه های قدیمی تر گنوم یک اپلت بسیار خوب با نام Character Palette بود که نمی دانم به طور پیشفرض در Unity هست یا نه. یک راه دیگر که خودم استفاده می کنم یک افزونه ای در فایرفاکس است که الان اسمش را حفظ نیستم (و پشت سیستمم هم نیستم). اگر عبارت character map یا از این قبیل را سرچ کنید این یا افزونه هایی از این دست را باید بتوانید پیدا کنید. --Z 16:43, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
افزونهٔ Charavter Pallete را روی فایرفاکس نصب کردم. دو سؤال نویسه‌گردانی: ۱) کی از i و کی از ê استفاده کنیم؟ ۲) لطفاً عرض و ارض را نویسه‌گردانی کنید. چند مثال را بررسی کردم گیج‌تر شدم (مثلاً علم). لطفاً اگر وقت کردید WT:FA TR را کمی گسترش دهید که از باقیات صالحات است. 4nn1l2 (talk) 17:40, 23 August 2015 (UTC)
متأسفانه هیچ قانون سفت‌وسختی برای نویسه‌گردانی فارسی نداریم. فارسی یک وضعیت منحصربفردی دارد و هر سیستمی که انتخاب کنیم ایرادهای مهمی دارد. استفاده از چند سیستم همزمان مدنظرم بود که همیشه کار جالبی نیست، من خودم در برخی مدخل‌ها از مجبوری این کار را می‌کنم، گاه هم بسته به نوع کلمه هرجا یکجور نویسه‌گردانی می‌کنم. وضعیت فعلی در ویکشنری اینست که اساس نویسه‌گردانی ما تلفظ فارسی ایران است. اما برخی مدخل‌های فارسی بیشتر از لحاظ ریشه‌شناسی اهمیت دارند. مثلاً در مدخل kofta اگر واژهٔ فارسی را kufte برگردانیم فقط خوانندگان را (که ۹۹درصدشان چیزی از فارسی و تحولات آوایی آن نمی‌دانند) گیج کرده‌ایم. یا مثلاً واژهٔ پولاد که صورت قدیمی دارای اُی کشیدهٔ آن در زبان‌های مختلفی حفظ شده است، در این موارد نویسه‌گردانی بر پایهٔ تلفظ قدیمی اهمیت می‌یابد. توصیه شخصی من اینست که هرجا نمی‌دانید چه کنید طبق فارسی ایران برگردانید: مثلاً ی را همیشه به i برگردانید. برای عین هم همیشه از ' استفاده کنید: 'arz برای عرض و arz برای ارض. --Z 20:30, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

Thanks...Edit

...for etymological help in Hindi! —Aryamanarora (मुझसे बात करो) 20:57, 31 December 2015 (UTC)

No problem! --Z 23:09, 31 December 2015 (UTC)
If you have time, could you figure out the etymology at दिल्ली अभी दूर है ‎(dillī abhī dūr hai)? I've written the Persian transliteration already. Thanks! —Aryamanarora (मुझसे बात करो) 00:29, 8 February 2016 (UTC)
Yes check.svg DoneΜετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 00:34, 8 February 2016 (UTC)
Thank you! —Aryamanarora (मुझसे बात करो) 02:08, 8 February 2016 (UTC)

گورEdit

Hi Z,

Is the etymology section at giaour correct? Do you mind expanding گور to add that sense? i want to make a Russian entry for гяу́р ‎(gjaúr), probably from the Persian. --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 23:47, 26 January 2016 (UTC)

Hi, I expanded the Persian entry. For the Ottoman Turkish word, I only found كاور (also can be spelled as گاور) in this dictionary as translation of "infidel", but I'm not sure how it is transliterated and pronounced (Dijan can probably help). By the way, the Persian by-form گور ‎(gavr) is pronounced with a palatalized g, maybe those "gj"/"gi"s are reflections of this phone. --Z 10:32, 27 January 2016 (UTC)
Thank you! --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 10:55, 27 January 2016 (UTC)
There is also the Old Anatolian Turkish form قاور ‎(ḳavur, enemy) (see Yaşar Çağbayır, Ötüken Türkçe Sözlük, vol III, J–Müt, 2007, page 2486), which looks like a hybrid between Persian گور ‎(gavr) and Arabic كَافِر ‎(kāfir). --Vahag (talk) 11:30, 27 January 2016 (UTC)
Strange transliteration of Old Anatolian Turkish, IMHO. We should probably use "q" for "ق", although the WP link uses "k" for both "ق" and "ك" (as in the resulting modern Turkish spellings). --Anatoli T. (обсудить/вклад) 11:40, 27 January 2016 (UTC)
It's the ALA-LC system. We don't have to agree on a system now. No one is doing Ottoman Turkish seriously on Wiktionary. We even don't know if Old Anatolian Turkish should be treated under Ottoman Turkish or as a separate language. --Vahag (talk) 12:05, 27 January 2016 (UTC)
I don't if this is relevant since I don't know about Old Anatolian Turkish and if ق ‎() was pronounced identically as ك ‎(k), but that word reminds me of a practice in earlier forms of New Persian, that is, writing particular letters in their Arabized form, even though they are not Arabic and/or not pronounced in their Arabic form, a notable case being Persian Petros, written as پطرس ‎(Peṭros) (in Arabic, بطرس), written with Arabic ط ‎(), or Persian bâtri (French), written as باطری ‎(bâṭri). I have seen this practice in Ottoman Turkish for European borrowings. However this is not the case (for Persian) for ق ‎(q), since it is not pronounced like ک ‎(k) in Persian. --Z 12:31, 27 January 2016 (UTC)
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