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User talk:Hans-Friedrich Tamke


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Do you speak Cree at all? We consider it undesirable to add words in a language that is unfamiliar. Dictionaries are often misleading or inaccurate in ways that only a hative speak can see.

We also want all Cree words in their native spelling. We (and other dictionaries) offer transcription as a way to provide access to the word for people who cannot read the Cree symbols, or for people who cannot see then on their computer. When we do have transcriptions, we use only one system, not all of them at once. This means that a speaker of Cree should help decided which transcriotion system to use; we cannot simply take three different versions wholesale from three different dictionaries. Each dictionary is using a system it thinks is appropriate, but that does not mean all three are appropriate to have here. Transcription must be consistent to be useful. --EncycloPetey 16:26, 4 August 2008 (UTC)


Please do not add back-translations in Translations sections. That is, do not add a translation into English in parentheses after a translation into German from English. Such information goes on the entry for the word, not in a Translations section. --EncycloPetey 07:46, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

Note: the "xs=" in the {{t}} tempate is not used except for very obscure languages. You do not need to add them, because a bot adds them when they are needed. --EncycloPetey 02:20, 5 July 2009 (UTC)


According to this edit you made, this is a masculine noun, but has a feminine meaning. Is that correct? --EncycloPetey 19:47, 13 June 2009 (UTC)


Why can't this just be defined as male dog . It seems redundant to me to say: dog (i.e. male dog or he-dog). What is a he-dog exactly? JamesjiaoTC 00:51, 22 October 2010 (UTC)


Is this supposed to be an endearing term? If it's just a normal term to refer to a small dog, then the use of doggie is inappropriate. doggie is an endearing term used by children to refer to pretty much all dogs. I don't know this language, but it just seems to be out of place to me. correct me if i am wrong. JamesjiaoTC 00:54, 22 October 2010 (UTC)


Please don't add superfluous transliterations. One is enough. If what you want to express is differences in pronunciation, learn IPA. — [ R·I·C ] opiaterein — 17:36, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

Also, do not put plurals in translation tables - in any language. The singular is sufficient. — [ R·I·C ] opiaterein — 17:37, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

predicative caseEdit

Surely this is used in more languages than Volapük. Nadando 03:12, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

intelligent designEdit

Aren't most of the Derived Terms in this article just Sum Of Parts? —AugPi (t) 02:23, 21 May 2011 (UTC)

Well, that wouldn't be a problem as long as the articles aren't actually created... —AugPi (t) 02:26, 21 May 2011 (UTC)

Country-Country wordsEdit

German-Canadian, Norwegian-Canadian, etc. = Are you sure these are really helpful for a dictionary? It seems like compound "Nation-Nation" words are obvious in general and don't convey any additional meaning when strung together. Tempodivalse [talk] 20:33, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

I've nominated the lot for deletion here. You can give your input there if you wish. Best regards, Tempodivalse [talk] 20:57, 4 July 2011 (UTC)

Plurals, Low German or otherwiseEdit

It's customary not to double-categorize plurals as both nouns and plurals. Also the head word (in bold) goes under the ===Noun=== header. Mglovesfun (talk) 13:24, 18 July 2011 (UTC)

Pagelunen etc.Edit

No big thing, but, if you create a page that you later feel is in error, it is better to insert a {{delete}} tag (often called a "speedy") than to blank the page.

Separately, Autoformat picks up lines in a translation section that have both Low German and Low Saxon in them. When they show up on clean-up lists, I have been deleting "Low Saxon", leaving "Low German". Does it matter which I delete? Which is preferred (Why?) ? DCDuring TALK 16:18, 22 July 2011 (UTC)
Unfortunately, the terms Low German and Low Saxon can have multiple definitions, depending on the writer. Both terms can have broad or narrow definitions. For example, some writers include Old English, Old Saxon, Old Frisian, and Old Dutch in a very broad definition of Low German as historically Low German languages as opposed to High German (i.e. Standard High German and the Middle German and Upper German dialects). Others use Low German as a synonym for the modern Low Saxon dialects, including (and sometimes excluding) Dutch Low Saxon (multiple dialects) and German Low Saxon (multiple dialects). Others subdivide Low German (Low Saxon) into East Low German (East Low Saxon) and West Low German (West Low Saxon), using the two terms synonymously. Other writers label the western Low German dialects as Low Saxon and label the eastern Low German dialects as East Low German. Apparently some Dutch Low Saxon speakers and writers (take offense and) do not like to refer to their dialects as Low "German", preferring the term Low Saxon. In Dutch the term they use for their dialects is Nedersaksisch (Low Saxon). There is both a Nedersaksisch (Dutch Low Saxon) Wikipedia (using an orthography based on Dutch) and a Plattdüütsch (Plattdeutsch, German Low Saxon) Wikipedia. It is not called the Neddersassisch Wikipedia (Neddersass'sch Wikipedia). The Plattdüütsch Wikipedia uses (mostly) a North Low Saxon-based orthography developed by the German Low Saxon linguist Johannes Sass (or Saß). For many, Low Saxon is short for North Low Saxon. So in summation, it is not easy to decide which term to use, Low Saxon or Low German. I use both terms. I prefer the term Low Saxon or even New Saxon (cf. Old Saxon, Middle Saxon, New Saxon and Old Low Saxon, Middle Low Saxon, New Low Saxon). I assume that the Dutch Low Saxon speakers and writers would prefer the term Low Saxon (a more politically correct term). Have an excellent day! Hans-Friedrich Tamke 19:50, 22 July 2011 (UTC)
Is there any prescription from ISO about the use of the code ("nds") or are the various parties fighting over the label to be associated with "nds"? What should I do about items in the translation table that have both names. I now delete whichever is in parenthesis. DCDuring TALK 21:08, 22 July 2011 (UTC)
The language code "nds" (ISO 639-3 - nds – Low German (generic), according to the Wikipedia article) is used for Low German in general and the code "" is used for Dutch Low Saxon. The Dutch Low Saxon Widipedia homepage URL is: <>. The Plattdüütsch (German Low Saxon) homepage URL is: <ööftsiet>. For more information, check out the articles: Dutch Low Saxon <> and Low German (Plattdüütsch, Nedderdüütsch, Standard German Plattdeutsch, Niederdeutsch; Dutch Nedersaksisch) <>. I am not sure what should be done with the labels. Maybe two labels could be used: nds-nl for Dutch Low Saxon (Dutch "Low German") and nds-de for German Low Saxon (German Low German). Hans-Friedrich Tamke 21:41, 22 July 2011 (UTC)
I don't understand the issues but it seems worth suggesting to Liliana fka PrinceKassad. DCDuring TALK 23:29, 22 July 2011 (UTC)
It might be late or irrelevant, but there is such a thing as: - feel free to participate and have a look at the discussion.Dakhart 01:15, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

Translations of adjectivesEdit

Please give only the lemma form of an adjective translation, not all the possible nominative singular forms. --EncycloPetey 01:31, 26 July 2011 (UTC)

Wiktionary:Requested entries (Volapük)Edit

There are other Volapük words to be added in there, if you know any of them; I'm just asking. --Lo Ximiendo 18:07, 31 July 2011 (UTC)

I'll try to add some of these requested Volapük words if I already know them or can find their meanings. Hans-Friedrich Tamke 18:14, 31 July 2011 (UTC)
You can also put it on your watchlist, if you want to, because I put requested words there sometimes. --Lo Ximiendo 00:11, 2 August 2011 (UTC)

Volapük translationsEdit

Please note my changes here to your translation contribution. This is the format you should use for the translations. Thanks for your contributions, but please use this format. :) 50 Xylophone Players talk 01:30, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

The problem with this change is that it is misleading for Volapük, since this language does not have a gender for nouns like French (m, f) and German (m, f, n). In Volapük, the word dog (this is not a masculine or feminine noun) means a "male or female dog", hidog (this is not a masculine noun) means a "male dog", jidog (is not a feminine noun) means a "female dog". I originally spelled out the full words as qualifiers in front of each word, like this: (male or female) dog (vo), (male) hidog (vo), (female) jidog (vo) and only later changed this to (♂♀) dog (vo), () hidog (vo), () jidog (vo) because it was much shorter. If these abbreviations for the actual sex of the animals (not the gender of the nouns) is not acceptable, then I guess I could go back to writing out the full words, but I would prefer not to do this. Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk) 02:25, 21 May 2012 (UTC)
Hmm, maybe this is something that needs to be discussed more, but I think perhaps it might be a good idea to use a format whereby you would only link to the "lemma" for translations (take it to be the male form) and in that entry have the female form and such shown. Take for example the French entries chien and aviateur; those terms have grammatical gender due to being French obviously, but the possible biological gender variation carries into their alternate forms. Also, another thing I noticed is our trans table for dog for the first, "basic" sense as in the kind of animal simply lists chien as the translation. 50 Xylophone Players talk 15:33, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

o dinosaurEdit

WT:TR#o dinosaur! is discussing this. Foremost among my concerns, w:Volapük indicates that Volapük doesn't even have a vocative case. Mglovesfun (talk) 08:55, 6 June 2012 (UTC)

Wiktionary:About YiddishEdit

Hi! I recently created this page, which is meant to have a centrally located repository of information about the standardized treatment of Yiddish on Wiktionary. I'm giving you this message because you have shown interest in Yiddish, and we need your help! The page especially needs better coverage of the many undocumented headword-line and conjugation templates, but any assistance is welcomed. Please feel free to edit the page, and to raise any issues for discussion at Wiktionary talk:About Yiddish. Thanks so much!

Derived termsEdit

Hi Hans-Friedrich, you added a huge list of "derived terms" to the entry Haus (and many others in the past). However, most of them are invalid. For example, plural forms don't belong there, only singular forms. Sum-of-parts terms such as Willkommen zu Hause! shouldn't have entries either. And AFAIK, only terms directly derived from Haus rather than from a compound that contains Haus should be listed: For example, all the words that start with Haustier- are derived from Haustier rather than Haus (Haustier itself is fine in this list, of course). There are even terms that don't even contain Haus (wechselseitiger Tausch, which is furthermore probably SOP). Longtrend (talk) 09:58, 16 December 2012 (UTC)

Thank you for your comments. I have broken down the one long list of words into multiple sections and have deleted the plural forms. I think this improves the page without needlessly deleting too many of these useful German words and phrases. Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk) 23:14, 16 December 2012 (UTC)

Low GermanEdit

Moin! Following several discussions, which culminated in WT:RFM#nds, nds-de, nds-nl, the various Dutch varieties of Low Saxon which had separate codes (Drents, Twents, etc) were merged into the code nds-nl (which had always represented generic Dutch varieties of Low Saxon). The various German varieties of Low German (Westphalian, etc) were merged into one code as well. Previously, nds had been used as the code for generic German varieties of Low German, and "Low German" had been used as the header. However, many people had assumed that nds and the header ==Low German== referred to both the German and Dutch varieties at once—or, interpreted another way, the header actually had been used both for "both varieties" and for "German only"— so the RFM replaced them with nds-de and ==German Low German== for maximal clarity. I have been slowly updating the entries to this format.

I notice that you changed Duuv to use "Low Saxon (Low German)". Wiktionary never combines two languages into one header, and headers must always match language codes. Also, the guideline for Dutch Low Saxon nouns is that we, like nds-nl.WP, don't capitalise them, so if "duuv" is an attested Dutch Low Saxon spelling, it should be at [[duuv]] (though the Dutch Low Saxon WP uses "doeve", "doef", "duve" and "doewe"). Please comment in the RFM if you disagree with the mergers of the subdialects (or think the merger should go further, e.g. combining both the German and Dutch macro-varieties), or comment on the talk pages of WT:ANDS, WT:ANDS-DE and WT:ANDS-NL if you have questions or suggestions. Cheers, - -sche (discuss) 00:43, 25 December 2012 (UTC)


Do you believe the word fête is pronounced "fight" in Quebec French ? Fête (talk) 02:55, 31 December 2012 (UTC)

  • The vowel sound ⟨ê⟩, as in the word ⟨fête⟩, is a diphthong in Quebec French and is pronounced something like [faɛ̯t]. The English word "fight" is pronounced [faɪ̯t], or in Canadian English, it is usually pronounced [fʌɪ̯t]. The English diphthongs are pronounced quite differently depending on the variety of English spoken by each individual speaker. Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk) 09:01, 31 December 2012 (UTC)

The word fête is not pronounced "fight" in Quebec French ? See Fête (talk) 14:53, 31 December 2012 (UTC)

  • The Quebec French diphthong that this man uses in his pronunciation of fête does indeed sound very similar to the English diphthong in the word "fight". For more detailed information on Quebec French diphthongs, you can go to the following webpage. - The Pronunciation of Canadian French by Douglas C. Walker - - Have an excellent day! Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk)


You've been adding a lot of Volapük terms, but most of them are not actually attestable. Per WT:CFI, Volapük requires three uses in durably archived media, and I can't find any uses of words like hikujöran. Just because a word can exist does not mean that it does exist. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 05:01, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

The word "hikujöran = Geburtshelfer, Accoucheur" (p. 349) was taken from the "Wörterbuch der Weltsprache für Deutschsprechende: Vödabuk Volapüka pro Deutänapükans [1] (German-Volapük Volapük-German Dictionary) Arie de Jong (Author), Michael Everson (Foreword)" [2012. Cathair na Mart: Evertype. →ISBN (hardcover)]. In the case of a word like gaaporn "lovebird" ([2]] gaaporn (=,agapornis' lat.) = Sperlingspapagei, Wellensittich, Inseparabel), this basic word exists in Volapük. It may be the only word listed in a dictionary or vocabulary list. This does not mean that other derived or related words "don't exist" or "can't exist", they have simply not been listed for this particular relatively uncommon basic word, unlike a more common word such as the word "gok" [3] and some of its derived or related forms ("gokabäset", "gokaböd", "gokafrikaset", "gokahauk", "gokalecek", "gokanögacärm", "gokated", "gokatedan", "gokavultur", "gokaxänöm", "gokayad", "gokibrid", "gokil", "higok", "higokafäitül", "higokakomip", "higokakrav", "higokil", "komipahigok", "kuvajigok", "kuvajigok", "koedön kuvön jigoki", "nifagok", "nögamajigok", "vatagok"). Even if no Volapükist has ever used or even seen the words "higaaporn", "jigaaporn", "gaapornül", "gaapornülik", "gaapornülem", "higaapornül", "jigaapornül", "gaapornil", "gaapornilem", "gaapornik", "gaapornem", "gaapornakap", "gaapornakapil", "gaapornagöb", "gaapornahoned", "gaapornaplüm", "gaapornaplüms", "gaapornaplümem", "gaapornaflitäm", "gaapornaflitäms", "gaapornalog", "gaapornalineg", "gaapornabäkabom", "gaapornalög", "gaapornalögs", "gaapornanäst", "gaapornalecek", "gaapornibrid", "gaapornibridan", "gaapornasüm", "gaapornasümik" (all these words are only given in their nominative case form), he will recognize these words as legitimate Volapük words if he understands the basics of Volapük word formation or word creation. Because of the very nature of Volapük (an agglutinative language) and therefore its very great capacity to "create" new words at will (basically ad infinitum), especially its ability to create new compound words (it is very similar to German in this respect), it is impossible to list or record every possible well-formed Volapük word in a dictionary (and it is not really necessary). A Volapük vocabulary or dictionary can only give a fairly limited sampling of the more common Volapük words and then the user is able to create more words, especially by analogy to the words already listed, which is usually quite limited, because of the limited number of people presently using or attempting to use Volapük. The more example words a person sees the better, then he can create his own words based on the principles of Volapük word formation. With this said I can restrict myself to adding only "attested" Volapük words to the English Wiktionary and still add thousands of words. Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk) 10:20, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
I understand that, but you haven't really addressed the problem that hijuköran itself is completely unciteable. Dictionaries don't count (see WT:ATTEST). Even if they are "listed", they do not necessarily exist; they must be used in Volapük books or magazines or newspapers or usenet groups first. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 14:43, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

If "dictionaries don't count" for a constructed language like Volapük, then following this rule, one apparently cannot cite the very words created and used (because they are "completely unciteable") that the creator of Volapük (Volapük Rigik), Johann Martin Schleyer ([4], [5]), himself used in his own dictionaries. This same rule would apply to Arie de Jong's ([6], [7]) two-way bilingual German-Volapük Volapük-German dictionary written using revised Volapük (Volapük Nulik [8]). Will the words kujöran [9], hikujöran [10], jikujöran [11] listed in the online Volapük Vükivödabuk need to be deleted since the creator of these pages cites the Wörterbuch der Weltsprache as his source? (I did not create those pages.) In that case a large number of the pages created and put online in the Volapük Wiktionary, using words from the Wörterbuch der Weltsprache, will have to be deleted, if they cannot be found in other sources (especially presently quite limited online sources, such a scanned books or magazine and newspaper articles that might cite these particular words, sometimes only used once). What about any of the words (possibly some only found in the book Kleinstes Wörterbuch der Weltsprache mit den 300... [12]) created by Johann Martin Schleyer, are they truly unusable for the purposes of the English Wiktionary? There are quite a few other bilingual dictionaries (and grammars) online, are these also useless as sources for Volapük words that can be used to create new entries for the English-language Wiktionary? Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk) 00:00, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

I don't know anything about the Volapük Wiktionary (, but these are the rules for the English Wiktionary ( There is a clause that says that one use in a "well-known work" suffices, so I think words found in books written by Schleyer are OK, but not words that are only found in wordlists or dictionaries without usage examples. (By the way, this is not just constructed languages. Please see WT:ATTEST for more.) So yes, I think words like jikujöran should be deleted if you cannot cite them. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 00:10, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Delete the English Wiktionary page for the Volapük word jikujöran (and any or all other pages with derived or related words) if you wish. Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk) 02:23, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

We have a process here called RFV (click the link for the page) which is for people to attempt to cite words before they get deleted. I'd rather not delete them iff they can be cited, and we'd probably have to go word by word. If you know or have (or can and wis to create) a list of unciteable Volapük words, that would help. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 02:52, 20 February 2013 (UTC)

Hi! The terms you added here contained a number of soft hyphens. I'm guessing that was in error... soft hyphens should not be used in links. (I removed them in this diff.) - -sche (discuss) 05:49, 14 June 2013 (UTC)

  • You are still adding terms that cannot be attested per WT:ATTEST, like Wikiwöörbook. Please understand that you are not improving the dictionary when you do this, merely making more work for others. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 23:06, 9 December 2016 (UTC)

pen (female swan)Edit

I'm a little confused about what's going on here. The word "pen" refers specifically to a female swan, but as far as I can tell, it seems like you've added translations that mean "swan", "male swan", and "female swan". Is there something I'm missing? Mr. Granger (talk) 20:28, 17 November 2013 (UTC)

This is the reason I added the three words svan, hisvan and jisvan. Unlike in many or possibly most natural languages, in Volapük there is a systematic three-way split in all the nouns for every sexual animal (including human beings, e.g., Kanadänan, hi-Kanadänan, ji-Kanadänan). This is also true for the constructed languages Ido and Novial. One word is used for either a male or a female (♂♀) (i.e., the sex of the animal is left unspecified or not made explicit for whatever reason), a second word is used for a male only (♂) and a third word is used for a female only (♀). The Volapük word svan is an epicene noun, with the meaning of a [male or female] "swan" (or "swan" in a more generic sense), thus this single word can include the meanings "swan" (male or female swan [sex unspecified] or swan [generically speaking]), "cob" (male swan) or "pen" (female swan). The word jisvan means "pen" or literally "she-swan". For the sake of completeness and to emphasize this systematic three-way split in Volapük for the sex of swans, I also added hisvan, which means "cob" or "he-swan" (The Story of Elmer, the Don Swan: [13]). Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk) 22:24, 19 November 2013 (UTC)
I understand how those Volapük prefixes work, but the fact remains that pen only means female swan - one would never translate it as hisvan or svan. Information about those words should certainly be included in the entry for svan, but not in the translation box for pen. Mr. Granger (talk) 22:42, 19 November 2013 (UTC)

Can you please stop adding ridiculous lists of words to translation boxes? It is not reasonable to include virfazano, fazanino, fazanido, virfazanido, and fazanidino all as Esperanto translations of the word "pheasant". A reader who wants that extreme level of detail will no doubt be quite willing to go to the page for fazano and find it there. (If all those words are even attested, which I highly doubt.) —Mr. Granger (talkcontribs) 22:12, 6 December 2013 (UTC)

"Le faisan [Esperanto: fazano] est un gibier à plume appartenant à la famille des phasianidés [eo: fazanedoj]. Il se distingue par son plumage aux couleurs très variées, en particulier chez le mâle [eo: masklo, virseksulo, iĉo, virfazano, fazaniĉo]. Le faisan a le corps allongé, un port élégant, une démarche très rapide et aisée. Le plumage est remarquable par l'éclat et la variété des couleurs chez le mâle. Dans leur premier âge, les faisandeaux mâles [eo: virfazanidoj, fazanidiĉoj] et femelles [eo: fazanidinoj] ont le même plumage terne. On distingue les sexes par la couleur de l'iris, qui est blanc chez le coq, brun chez la poule [eo: femalo, inseksulo, ino]. La mue a lieu à l'automne, et les mâles commencent alors à prendre leur plumage d'adulte." [14]
Here's an excerpt (another ridiculous list of words) taken from: Harrap's New Standard French And English Dictionary - Volume One - French—English A—I (London and Paris 1981)
faisan [fɛzɑ̃, fəzɑ̃] s.m. 1. (coq) f., (cock) pheasant;
f. doré, golden pheasant; f. de chasse pheasant
(phasianus colchicus); f. de chasse de Chine,
Chinese ring-necked pheasant; f. bruyant,
grouse. 2. P. crook.
faisances [fɛzɑ̃ːs, fə-], dues in kind paid by tenant
farmer over and above his rent.
faisandage [fɛzɑ̃daːʒ, fə-] s.m. Cu: hanging (of
meat, esp. game); allowing (of meat esp. game)
to get high.
faisandé [fɛzɑ̃de, fə-], a. (a) high, gamy (meat); (b)
F: spicy (story); (c) F: decadent (literature,
aristocracy, etc.).
faisandeau, -eaux [fɛzɑ̃do, fə-], s.m. young pheas-
ant, young poult.
faisander [fɛzɑ̃de, fə-], l. Cu: to hang (meat,
esp. game). 2. P: to cheat.
se faisander to get high.
faisanderie [fɛzɑ̃dri, fə-], s.f. pheasantry, pheasant
faisandier, -ière [fɛzɑ̃dje, -jɛːr; fə-]. l. a. phea-
sant (tribe, etc.). 2. s. pheasant breeder.
faisane [fɛzan, fə-] s.f. (poule) f., hen
Here are more of the same ...ridiculous lists of words... (that ought to be added to this or possibly another Wiktionary).
ĉevalo: cheval / kavalo / horse
virĉevalo, ĉevaliĉo, stalono: étalon / kavalulo / stallion, he-horse
ĉevalino: jument / kavalino / mare, she-horse
ĉevalido: poulain / kavalyuno / foal
virĉevalido, ĉevalidiĉo: kavalyunulo / colt
ĉevalidino: pouliche / kavalyunino / filly
English: hissy fit (Was zum Kuckuck soll das bedeuten? Deutsch: Wutanfall, Wutausbruch)
Have an excellent day! Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk) 09:19, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
I'm afraid I don't quite follow what all these French words have to do with what I'm saying. —Mr. Granger (talkcontribs) 15:55, 8 December 2013 (UTC)
Perhaps you should spend your efforts on Wikisaurus entries rather than cluttering dictionary entries with anything-that-might-be-construed-as-somehow-distantly-sort-of-connected-to-the-lemma-if-you-squint-and-look-cross-eyed-at-it-while-standing-on-your-toes-and-leaning-sideways sorts of terms. Either that or just save time and put:
See also
on every page. Chuck Entz (talk) 07:27, 10 December 2013 (UTC)

See alsoEdit

Please stop adding such huge numbers of irrelevant "see also" links, as you did here and here. Readers do not need to see a half dozen translations of a word in a See also section, nor do they need to see 20 other words whose only apparent connection to the word in question is that they have the same suffix. —Mr. Granger (talkcontribs) 05:57, 9 December 2013 (UTC)

Volapük etymologiesEdit

Could you make them simpler? They're really hard for me to understand because there's just so many brackets and other details. You really don't need to elaborate on the etymology of each part of a word down to the smallest detail. That's just duplicating the information that is already in other entries. —CodeCat 01:58, 24 December 2013 (UTC)

The same applies to the definitions you've been adding to plural forms. That's just duplication and it makes maintenance more difficult. What if someone wants to change the definition of the main entry? Should they update all the forms as well? They're probably not going to do that so it will become a mess with different forms having different definitions. It's better to keep definitions in one place. There's even a discussion in the BP right now about making this a proper policy: no definitions on inflection entries. —CodeCat 02:05, 24 December 2013 (UTC)

  • You're right. I will try to follow your two recommendations. Thanks. Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk) 02:18, 24 December 2013 (UTC)

♂ und ♀ ZeichenEdit


Ich habe bemerkt, dass du {{qualifier|male}} und {{qualifier|female}} mit {{qualifier|♂}} und {{qualifier|♀}} ersetzt, z.B. in manicurist und pedicurist. Ich mag das besonders nicht, aber ich habe deine Bearbeitung vorerst so gelassen. Kannst du bitte an dieser Besprechung teilnehmen? Es sieht so aus, dass die meisten Teilnehmer {{qualifier|male}} und {{qualifier|female}} vorziehen. --Anatoli (обсудить/вклад) 03:38, 6 January 2014 (UTC)

Volapük suffixes -ot and -ömEdit

What do these suffixes do? I'm just curious about them. --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 05:26, 18 January 2014 (UTC)

First off, sorry for the long delay in my answer to your question. There is a partial list of prefixes and suffixes for Volapük in the online article "AN INTRODUCTION TO VOLAPÜK" by Ed. Robertson, February 1994 (website: It gives an explanation of their meanings with a few example words. Prefixes: be- (givön "[to] give" -> begivön) "[to] present with" - (Makes what was the indirect object the direct object), fi- (to the end), hi- (male), ji- (female), ke- (together), läx- (ex-), le- (greatness), lu- (disparagement or step relationship), lü- (in-law), ne- (opposite), ru- (ancient). Suffixes: -am (verbal noun), -ag (abundance), -an (person associated), -at (amount of), -av (science), -äb (victim), -äd (generalisation of effect), -än (country), -ät (abstraction), -ed (particularisation), -ef (group of people, -el (maker of), -em (group of things), -et (consequential or concrete example), -iäl (inclination), -il (diminutive), -im, (philosophy), -od (softer or less serious example), -ot (harder or more serious example), -ov (possibility), -öf (quality), -öm (equipment), -öp (place), -ül (young of animals, endearment). Unfortunately, the short explanations for the meanings of some of these affixes is not always clear or unambiguous. I think that a person needs a lot of examples of their actual use in Volapük to get a feel for them. Here are some example words with the suffix -ot: birön "[to] brew" (bir "beer") -> birot "brew" "brewage (the result of brewing, what is brewed) (de: Gebräu); blünön "[to] deliver (bring)" (cf. blinön "[to] bring") -> blünot "delivery" (that which was delivered or brought, the thing delivered or brought, the result of the action of delivering); big "thickness, being thick" -> bigot "(measured) thickness", lun "longness, length" -> lunot "(spatial) length", lunet "(geographical) length"; blodön "[to] embroider", brod "(activity of) embroidering, embroidery", "brodalekan "art of embroidery", brodot "embroidered work, what has been embroidered, an embroidery"; bum "(action or activity of) building", bumön "to build" -> bumot "a building, what has been built" (de: erbauen (bauen) "[to] build, construct", Gebäude "a building"); buk "book", bük "(action of) printing", bükön "(to) print" -> bükot "printed matter, printed work, something printed (up)"; brek "breaking, fracturing", brekön "(to) break" -> brekot "a broken piece, fragment" -> brekotön "(to) fragment", brekod "a fracture"; mag "imaging, depiction, illustration, illustrating" -> magod "picture (an illustration)", magodön "(to) illustrate", magot "statue"; bob "(the fact of) being bowed" -> bobot " something bowed, bulged out, arched" Here are some other words with a similar morphological structure: fag, fagot; dün, dünot, dünotem; jen, jenot; bäld, bäldot; dib, dibot; glät, glätot; dalab, dalabot, smel, smelot, benosmelot; flök, flökot; gag, gagot; fin, finot, futofinot; fom, fomot; gret, gretot; fib, fibot; flum, flumot, balidflumot; bak, bakot, bakotem; geil, geilot; benosüp (süp), benosüpot; dabin, dabinot; fail, failot, bumädafailot; dil, dilot; köd, ködot, boadiködot; vob, vobot, goldavobot; fil, filot; defom, defomot; jaf, jafot; gav, gavot; boad, boadot; yüm, foyümot, poyümot; glid, glidot, kuv, kuvot, fitakuvot; fid, fidot; fabrik, fabrikot. There are also numerous nouns that have the -öm suffix (poyümot), for example: jel -> jelöm "umbrella or parasol", reinajelöm "umbrella", solajelöm "parasol"; datom -> datomöm "torture device, instrument of torture"; gad -> gadöm "garden tool, gardening tool"; xänöm "ladder" -> xänömatrid (rung [of a ladder]); brak -> braköm "flax break, flax breaker"; biliar (de: Billardspiel) -> biliaröm (de: Billard), blad -> bladöm "bellows"; frap -> frapöm "die, embossing punch"; fön "stove" + jelöm -> fönajelöm "firescreen"; frenön "(to) break", fren -> frenöm "break"; fonograf -> fonograföm "phonograph, record player, gramophone"; dialit -> dialitöm "dialyzer, dialyser"; häktograf -> häktograföm "hectograph, jellygraph, transfer tablet, gelatin duplicator", gin -> ginöm; fagiolog -> fagiologöm "binoculars, field glass; cep -> cepöm "(threshing) flail; huk, huko "by or with a hook", päskar "(action of) fishing", hukopäskar -> hukopäskaröm "fishing tackle, fishing gear" (de: Angel, Angelgerät); gifül -> gifülöm "watering can"; nok "knuckle" -> noköm "door knocker, yan + noköm -> yananoköm "doorknocker"; harmon -> harmonöm "harmonica, mouth organ"; flit -> flitöm "airplane, aeroplane, plane, aircraft, flying machine (de: Flugmaschine, Flugzeug); filid (fil) -> filidöm "(cigarette) lighter" (Feuerzeug); telefon "telephony" -> telefonöm "telephone, phone"; nün -> nünöm "computer"; dabük -> dabüköm "printer" (computer); bodifiläd -> bodifilädöm "(bread) toaster"; boidastutöm (stutöm) "balustrade"; stutömastul "armchair" (= bradastul ) (stutöm, stut "rest", "headrest", "armrest", stutön (len) "(to) lean (against/on)"); bradastutöm "armrest"(on chair; büg "can, tin", maif "being open", maifik "open" maifikön vt, maifükön vt, maifük -> bügimaifüköm "can-opener, tin-opener"; fal + jelöm -> falajelöm "parachute"; feafomöm "transformer" (electrical); fut + frenöm -> futafrenöm "foot brake", namafrenöm "handbrake"; [[kledön] "(to) sway, see-saw", kled "swaying, see-sawing" -> kledöm "seesaw"; koitön "(to) have intercourse, mate (with)", koit "coitus" -> koitöm "penis"; koldülüköm "cooler, a (car) radiator"; kurbidöm "(electric) switch"; musig -> musigöm "(musical) instrument"; nit "staple" -> nitöm "stapler"; pendülön, pendül -> pendülöm "(children's) swing"; [pömön]] "(to) pump", [pöm]] > [pömöm]] "pump"; [sab]] "sand" -> saböm "sandtimer, hourglass, clepsammia"; skrub "screw" + tulöm -> skrubitulöm "screwdriver"; stofäd + knib -> stofädikniböm "clothes-peg"; störöm "poker" (for fire); televid "television" -> televidöm "television (set)"; tonodiregistaröm "tape-recorder"; tonodisumodöm "record-player"; tovön "(to) lift", [tov]] -> tovöm "jack"; tridön "(to) step, tread on", trid "stair, step" -> [tridöm]] "pedal" (for car); vabön "(to) drive", vab, vaböm -> "vehicle". So that is it for now. Volapük is indeed a fascinating language for those that examine it more closely in its structure. Have an excellent day! -- Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk) 10:11, 12 August 2016 (UTC)
Thanks for the explanation. I've changed "harder" in -ot to "more concrete" based on your explanation. Perhaps "example" would better be replaced by something like "instance" as well, but I left it there for now. Lingo Bingo Dingo (talk) 11:19, 31 August 2016 (UTC)

Global accountEdit

Hi Hans-Friedrich! As a Steward I'm involved in the upcoming unification of all accounts organized by the Wikimedia Foundation (see m:Single User Login finalisation announcement). By looking at your account, I realized that you don't have a global account yet. In order to secure your name, I recommend you to create such account on your own by submitting your password on Special:MergeAccount and unifying your local accounts. If you have any problems with doing that or further questions, please don't hesitate to contact me on my talk page. Cheers, DerHexer (talk) 18:17, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

kunül, torül and BajkiränapükEdit

Greetings. kunül, torül and Bajkiränapük are currently in WT:RFV. Any help in finding attesting quotations for these terms to show these meet WT:ATTEST would be appreciated. --Dan Polansky (talk) 19:05, 4 September 2016 (UTC)

German Low German "Tung"Edit

I updated the entry for Low German Tung. --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 01:16, 6 September 2016 (UTC)

Thanks! Schönen Tag noch! Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk) 07:39, 6 September 2016 (UTC)
Now I updated Koh and Worm. --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 08:00, 12 September 2016 (UTC)
And Kos. --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 08:15, 12 September 2016 (UTC)
And Wust. --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 08:46, 12 September 2016 (UTC)
Now Kropp. --Lo Ximiendo (talk) 09:44, 12 September 2016 (UTC)
Thanks again for all of your work. Have an excellent day! Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk) 17:27, 12 September 2016 (UTC)

A few revertsEdit

The Yiddish is already linked to at the top of the page. We shouldn't be putting a different language in Hebrew's see also sections. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 15:50, 27 September 2016 (UTC)

If they belong anywhere, you could put them in a descendants section. But then you have the question of whether they came into Yiddish from Hebrew or Aramaic. And I don't know the answer to that for the Hebrew month names. --WikiTiki89 16:01, 27 September 2016 (UTC)
  • Please look around at existing entries before editing in a language you are not familiar with. I have deleted Jia1na2da4; Chinese editors have chosen not to have such entries. —Μετάknowledgediscuss/deeds 06:51, 20 February 2017 (UTC)

Alternative FormsEdit

Hey there. Last month a vote passed allowing alternative forms to be placed either as before (the way you place them) or as an L4 above the synonyms. I prefer the L4 variant and use that in Middle Low German because it offers a better overview, especially if you have long lists like in Low German. Maybe you want to give it a thought, for uniformity's sake. I'm no big Low German editor and won't argue if you do it the old way, though. Korn [kʰũːɘ̃n] (talk) 10:55, 8 November 2016 (UTC

Thanks for informing me about the recent vote concerning the option of where to place alternative forms. I will probably use the second L4 option that you mentioned. Thanks again and have a great day. Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk) 04:51, 9 November 2016 (UTC)

Too Much InformationEdit

Please don't add translations for predictable gender-forms (completely unpredictable and common ones such as English mare and Spanish yegua are okay). We structure our entries so that people can find that information from the lemma of one of the forms (by convention, the masculine singular), so adding the other forms to the translations is just redundant clutter. Yes, such forms may exist, but then so does the ablative plural of the future passive participle in Latin verbs, and we don't add those, either. You've been told this before, but you apparently are choosing to forget. Please stop it. Chuck Entz (talk) 14:34, 23 February 2017 (UTC)

Italian feminine plural adjectivesEdit

Hi there. We define these as the feminine plural of the masculine singular (lemma-form) adjective. SemperBlotto (talk) 15:36, 26 July 2017 (UTC)

Adjectives have feminine singular, feminine plural and masculine plural forms. Nouns don't have feminine forms, only plural forms. Genders should only be indicated in the headword line for noun lemmas. Please fix your edits. —CodeCat 16:23, 26 July 2017 (UTC)


Um, we don't typically show gender for plural forms, do we ? Leasnam (talk) 04:35, 20 January 2018 (UTC)

Past attempts of mine to do so were quickly reverted... Leasnam (talk) 04:36, 20 January 2018 (UTC)

That’s good to know. Thanks! Hans-Friedrich Tamke (talk) 04:39, 20 January 2018 (UTC)

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